Centrepins

[Carp Angler]

I understand and accept the difference that you state exists between the momemtum and initial inertia needed to exert to enable a reel to spin, but to suggest that the Leeds is a heavy reel and that's why it spins longer is complete rubbish. The Leeds needs to be constantly checked otherwise it will almost spin of its own volition. Moving the reel in your hand causes the drum to rotate, and that is minimal inertia. I will state again that it is the smoothest running reel that I have seen and would also state that it is the easiest I've seen to start to spin.

 

[Alan Cooper]

Didn't want to upset you Carp Angler! But I am talking comparative weights here - the Leeds is a fairly solidly built reel - as is the similar Adcock Stanton. Both these reels are not exactly sludge machines when it comes to free running. However, I am willing to bet that if you subject your Leeds to the test I've outlined - the inertia test with split shot added to see how much / many it takes to start spinning the reel - it will not beat my Lincoln (one No4 + one No6). I am not going to disagree with you when you say that the Leeds spins freely - it certainly does, it is a question of "how freely" compared to other reels and what the job in hand actually is. IF it is float trotting or freelining - then a reel can hardly be free enough. I've not found anything better than my Lincoln up to now and that includes expensive reels. However, for all that, if you can prove to me that the Leeds beats the Lincoln (and others) on the test I propose I will go out and buy one!

 

[Alan Roe]

I have just been in touch with J.W.Youngs to see about converting my old Trudexes to left hand wind. They were most helpful and were telling me about a new centerpin that they are producing specifically designed for Wallis casting with.
They are calling it the Bob James centerpin....no comment!!
You can see it on their website www.jwyoung.co.uk. It looks nice to me I belive it wiil be marketed through Masterline.
As I have said before if anyone wishes to learn how to Wallis cast I am happy to show them
Cheers Alan

 

[paul williams]

Just a quick line to say as someone who has only dabbled with a pin (trotting Avon type floats) i have found this debate very interesting.

 

[Alan Roe]

Hello Paul I am glad that you have enjoyed it I have enjoyed being involved in it
Cheers Alan

 

[Andrew Miller]

Can someone tell me the correct way to load the pin. I been told only to cover the drum but I seen "expert" with pin that are quite full. I actually own a Carter pin but never realised it worth! I think I put it in the vault now!

 

[Alan Cooper]

Get the Carter in the vault double quick Andrew! But I am sure you would sooner use it! As to your question, really this is a matter of taste. Some centrepin fanatics only put 75 yards or so on. I put all of a 100 metre reel on personally. The extra 30 yards or so makes no difference to the reel's performance and gives you a little more to play with. If you are sidecasting, the same principle as loading a fixed spool applies - a fullish drum.

 

[Alan Roe]

I tend to use 50-60 yards most of the time as I find that it cuts down on the problem of bedding in.
I agree that the price that Carter reels are now changing hands at is ridiculous and can distract from the real worth of the reel as a pleasurable tool to fish with. Just use it for the purpose it was intended and sod the collectors market. Why anyone should want to hoard perfectly good reels in a glass case merely to gloat over them is beyond me....

 

[Keith Finn]

You are right about sticking them in a case.
Try buying a second hand one to use for fishing, its intended purpose, and people look at you as if you are mad!.

 

[Alan Cooper]

I totally agree about the "glass case" syndrome - it is the worst kind of insanity. I have just bought a Paul Witcher centrepin which has cost me an arm and a leg and much else besides. It is made of brass and is thus heavy and spins (the dreaded and useless "spin test" for a minute and a half easily. And here is the really good bit - it starts to revolve with ONE No 6 shot on the line (inertia test) - so I can use it comfortably on medium flowing streams. On NO ACCOUNT is this reel ever going into a glass case!

 

[Alan Roe]

I'm delighted to hear that you have obtained on of the Paul Witcher reels you must earn more down south!!
The thing that annoys me as much as anything about the glass case brigade is that their activities have had a knock on effect which pushed the price of most centerpins up and gave a false set of values to the gullible.
I think that a lot more people would start to use centerpins on the grounds of their efficiency if they could be obtained at a reasonable price.
Shakespeare currently produce a range of fixed spool reels with five sets of ballbearings and everything balanced for ?16 I know I bought one for my lad.
The cheapest pin type reel is ?45 I am sure that the tackle trade can do better than that, to manufature a good working centerpin is scarcely rocket sience is it..

 

[Alan Cooper]

I have had to dig very deep Alan! But you are right about the price of decent centrepins. The Witcher would aleways be expensive - there were only two made of the Elite No1 model. I remember John Wilson making a comment about it in one of his books. There is the (approx) ?40 Lincoln and I have gone on about how free running this reel is. However, I don't see it as a good reel for a beginner at all what with its lack of check and the sidecast mechanism + big reel foot. The Leeds is a similar priced reel to the Lincoln but even some of these don't have check facilities, although others have.

 

[Alan Roe]

I have noticed that there is a reel, again made by Youngs for Browning which has been dubbed the 'Rotator' which looks like a vastly improved 'Trudex'it is a true centerpin action and has a check and has a drag as well currently one of the net sites is flogging it at ?80 which isn't too bad.
We could do with a few more of this type of reel being made easily available so that others can have the opportunity to obtain one and begin to enjoy for themselves the pleasure of fishing with the centerpin.
I spoke to one of Youngs staff the other day and the only problem with the reel is the colour which seems to put a lot of anglers off having said that the name they gave it isn't too clever either.
I am trying to persuade Youngs to market it in different colours and hopefully hit a larger audience..

 

[Dan Wellington]

hi there chaps, congrats on an interesting topic,one question from a pin novice "can anyone briefly explain the wallis cast ?" also i'm interested in purchasing a centrepin for around ?150 any suggestions ?

 

[Alan Cooper]

Hello Dan, a difficult question this but as Alan Roe has just noted - the answer should be easy in terms of loads of choice - which there ain't! And there is also something of the "one man's meat..." syndrome associated with this as well. However, the Browning (Youngs) "Rotator" might be worth a look. I have an original Rapidex (which I won years ago trotting on the Kennet in a knock out competition)which has served me well for years fishing close in and legering. However, see passim above - it has a fairly high inertia and so isn't really suitable for trotting. From what Alan Roe has said, I would advise cobbling together another ?30/?40 (if poss) and going for a Browning "Revolver" (Youngs) from the discount Fishing Warehouse - you will need to 'phone around for a best price. You can buy it from Bennets "on tick" but you will pay full whack. Another alternative is a redesigned "Swallow" from Ringwood reels. This is not the original "Swallow" which had a spoked drum which the line wrapped round and is lighter than the new "Swallow" with a solid drum (as is the Relum which is a Chinese copy). The Ringwood reels version costs about ?150 and the Relum version goes for about ?100. Both very good reels, but I dounbt(I fancy) as free running as Dave Swallow's original. As I have said above, no matter what reel you buy, if you use it for freelining or trotting, it will pay you ten times over if you go for the free-est running reel you can - see comments on Lincoln above but be WARY of it if you are a real beginner with centrepins. It gets me in a state at times!

 

[Alan Cooper]

Sorry Dan - I didn't answer the question re Wallis casting because I'm not so sure either. I always used to think it meant having the reel set up for right hand wind (if you are right handed) and "flicking" the drum with your little finger on your right hand as you cast. However, I don't think that this is right and I have been "doing it" for years. I'll see what Alan Roe and others say!

 

[Alan Roe]

Hello Dan the "Wallis cast" takes up a lot of words to explain but I can show it you in 10 minuets flat and have you doing it within an hour! after that it is just practise.
However the verbal explanation goes thus:- Assuming you are right handed the reel is mounted on the rod with the handles facing left. Hold the trod in the right hand and face the direction you wish the cast to go in.
Assuming you are using float tackle in the left hand trap your bottom tell tale shot in the crease that is found at the base of the little finger thus allowing the hook to hang down below the hand. Now place the forefinger (though some prefer the thumb) in the space between the reel and the butt ring of the rod and draw off just enough line to feel comfortable.
Now bring the rod up towards the left shoulder....
Here is the tricky bit!!Sweep the rod forward in a sidecasting motion and at one and the same time drop the shot that you were holding and smoothly and swiftly pull backwards with the forefinger or thumb of the left hand creating a fast growing loop which at the same time sets the reel spinning then start to bring the left hand forward so it becomes close to the right use the thumb of the right hand to control the spool of the reel checking it just as the tackle hits the water...
A little practise is needed!!!If you wish to see how it is done e mail me direct the address is somewhere earlier in this discussion.
Cheers Alan

 

[Alan Cooper]

Well almost! I've almost being Wallis casting in my previous fishing existence and today in my reincarnation! The only thing I wasn't doing (and still not doing) is holding the tell-tale shot. I'll have to try it. But I can remember my description (I might remember it wrong) coming from one of the Crabtree books from long ago. Can anyone else recall this "reel the wrong way round" account of the Wallis cast?

 

[Alan Roe]

Hello Alan.
The description of the wallis cast as written by Bernard Venables in Mr Crabtree goes fishing contains just enough inacuracies to make it virtually impossible to do.
F.W.K.Wallis decribes the cast in "Fine Angling for Coarse Fish" Chapter 14( The Lonsdale Library). Though it is hard to follow as it is written in arcane language!!! I hope that there is petrol for you on the 23/24 th when you come up

 

[Alan Roe]

Hello Dan have you tried the Wallis cast as I have outlined for you