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Gary Knowles
Guest
Oh, and Rik.......don't get paranoid mate 
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Carp Angler
Guest
I know some people who fish for carp who are idiots, I wouldn't call them anglers, but then again I know people who are as equally idiotic and fish for barbel and pike.
Carp angling lends itself well to the people who camp out with rods.
I could start spouting instances of where barbel anglers have been stupid, but it would just end up in a slanging match and I'd hope we were above that.
Carp angling lends itself well to the people who camp out with rods.
I could start spouting instances of where barbel anglers have been stupid, but it would just end up in a slanging match and I'd hope we were above that.
M
Malcolm Bason
Guest
I must confess to having a few beers with friends when fishing - a semi-social, I suppose one could call it! But we always bivvie up in 3 or 4 adjoining swims and gather around the middle so that no-one is further away from their rods than about 20yrds at any one time!
Personally, I feel this is acceptable!
However, if for any reason I have to go further afield, then the lines are brought in - and I reckon this would go for any responsible angler - carp-angler or otherwise.
Regarding Bivvie-slippers, I have nothing against them and have, in fact, thought of buying some myself! The reason I mentioned them in the first place is that I have seen some anglers, on having their alarms sound, having to first of all unzip themselves, (careful brummie) then put on bivvie slippers prior to lifting the rod - all such things slow us down - I really use it as an example.
Personally, I feel this is acceptable!
However, if for any reason I have to go further afield, then the lines are brought in - and I reckon this would go for any responsible angler - carp-angler or otherwise.
Regarding Bivvie-slippers, I have nothing against them and have, in fact, thought of buying some myself! The reason I mentioned them in the first place is that I have seen some anglers, on having their alarms sound, having to first of all unzip themselves, (careful brummie) then put on bivvie slippers prior to lifting the rod - all such things slow us down - I really use it as an example.
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Steve Burke
Guest
I choose to wind my baits in at night so that I can get an undisturbed night's sleep - I don't want to be woken up at 2am whatever the size of the fish! But I don't expect others to do the same, and I'm quite happy that all my syndicate members leave their baits out overnight.
However, I have to admit that I've occasionally dozed off during the day - I suspect the vast majority of us have if we're honest.
Surely it comes down to what's safe for the fish? I can accept that on certain snaggy waters that going to sleep on the rods can be dangerous. However, does this rule apply on all this club's waters, snaggy or not?
In many cases specialists, especially carp anglers, seem to be discriminated against by match-orientated clubs. To be fair, one of the problems, especially for the smaller clubs with only one water, is that they have to cater for all types of angler. For clubs that have more than one water I reckon the best solution is to manage the fishery and set the rules slightly differently on each water if need be.
Wandering off far from your rods is to my mind inexcusable at all times, and would mean instant expulsion for any member at Wingham. Luckilly, I've never had such a problem as every member is made aware of this from the start and supports the rule.
But how far, or more to the point how long in time is reasonable? How do you define "in immediate control"? It could be argued that an angler could get back to his rods more quickly from the next swim than he could from a zipped-up sleeping bag in a zipped-up bivvie.
However, I have to admit that I've occasionally dozed off during the day - I suspect the vast majority of us have if we're honest.
Surely it comes down to what's safe for the fish? I can accept that on certain snaggy waters that going to sleep on the rods can be dangerous. However, does this rule apply on all this club's waters, snaggy or not?
In many cases specialists, especially carp anglers, seem to be discriminated against by match-orientated clubs. To be fair, one of the problems, especially for the smaller clubs with only one water, is that they have to cater for all types of angler. For clubs that have more than one water I reckon the best solution is to manage the fishery and set the rules slightly differently on each water if need be.
Wandering off far from your rods is to my mind inexcusable at all times, and would mean instant expulsion for any member at Wingham. Luckilly, I've never had such a problem as every member is made aware of this from the start and supports the rule.
But how far, or more to the point how long in time is reasonable? How do you define "in immediate control"? It could be argued that an angler could get back to his rods more quickly from the next swim than he could from a zipped-up sleeping bag in a zipped-up bivvie.
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Stewart Bloor
Guest
This is not a trick question, or intending to wind anyone up. It's a genuine question.
Why do Fox, for example, make receivers for bite alarms that can receive a signal, as in the case of the LXR, at up to 200 metres.
Whatever the reasoning, is this encouraging straying from rods? What do you think?
Why do Fox, for example, make receivers for bite alarms that can receive a signal, as in the case of the LXR, at up to 200 metres.
Whatever the reasoning, is this encouraging straying from rods? What do you think?
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Malcolm Bason
Guest
Good question Sedge. I've often wondered the same, and have the said system myself.
I use the remotes for two reasons:
(1) when a few of us are gathered around the one swim at least three of us have fox alarms and one can see in an instant who has the bite - and with single beeps it is immediate which rod is getting the attention;
(2) because when you turn the volume down on the alrms the remote is not affected - this means I can turn the volume of the alarms right down so that I don't disturb other anglers, but still hear clearly within my bivvie!
Going back to the last point of your question, Sedge, yes I think the likes of Fox (and others) are encouraging the straying from one's rods by advertising a range of 200 metres.
I use the remotes for two reasons:
(1) when a few of us are gathered around the one swim at least three of us have fox alarms and one can see in an instant who has the bite - and with single beeps it is immediate which rod is getting the attention;
(2) because when you turn the volume down on the alrms the remote is not affected - this means I can turn the volume of the alarms right down so that I don't disturb other anglers, but still hear clearly within my bivvie!
Going back to the last point of your question, Sedge, yes I think the likes of Fox (and others) are encouraging the straying from one's rods by advertising a range of 200 metres.
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Dave Oates
Guest
How many sports are you able to sleep whilst doing? Can you honestly say that you are in control.
Are some of todays "tactics" that far from deadlining.....
Are some of todays "tactics" that far from deadlining.....
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Steve Burke
Guest
It's all very well that the alarms have a 200 metre range. However, advertising it is IMO irresponsible.
One other advantage of them to add to Malcolm's list is that there's no wires to fall over when the receiver is in your bivvie.
Whilst I can see their use, I don't own one myself as I'm always in earshot of my rods.
One other advantage of them to add to Malcolm's list is that there's no wires to fall over when the receiver is in your bivvie.
Whilst I can see their use, I don't own one myself as I'm always in earshot of my rods.
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Peter Waller
Guest
This has to be the most difficult question of the year, so far!
My immediate reaction is that it is a question of attitude. Is sleeping with lines out really angling? It is to some folk. Misguided personal predudice could see a return to just 'one rod in hand'. Perhaps we need a spot of research before we go much further.
Perhaps, on public waters, where contol is minimal or non existant, maybe it would be in every ones interest, not least the fish's, to see it discouraged. But lets have some facts before we decide.
On 'owned' waters, where fish might be worth many thousands of pounds, it is surely up to the responsible owner to consider if these valuable fish are at risk or not. The owner is in control, setting the standard by which his investment is considered safe. If modern techniques meet the required standards of fish safety then why not? The 'cash value' criterior suggests it is acceptable.
My immediate reaction is that it is a question of attitude. Is sleeping with lines out really angling? It is to some folk. Misguided personal predudice could see a return to just 'one rod in hand'. Perhaps we need a spot of research before we go much further.
Perhaps, on public waters, where contol is minimal or non existant, maybe it would be in every ones interest, not least the fish's, to see it discouraged. But lets have some facts before we decide.
On 'owned' waters, where fish might be worth many thousands of pounds, it is surely up to the responsible owner to consider if these valuable fish are at risk or not. The owner is in control, setting the standard by which his investment is considered safe. If modern techniques meet the required standards of fish safety then why not? The 'cash value' criterior suggests it is acceptable.
Murray Rogers
Well-known member
Peter.
The fish are always at risk. we stick hooks in them !!!!!!
The fish are always at risk. we stick hooks in them !!!!!!
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Gary Knowles
Guest
Rik,
I wasn't having a go at carp anglers in general, just pointing out that this particular rule may have been brought about by the actions of carp anglers one one water in particular.
Like you say every branch of angling has its share of idiots. I think its just the fact that there is some pretty easy carp fishing available these days for those that want it and this, coupled with the 'self hooking' rigs that, lets face it, bolt rigs are, lends itself well to lazy, p*ssheads so they tend to move into carp angling. Thereby giving the serious guys an undeserved bad name, some of the best specci guys i know used to be carp anglers before they saw the light.....
I'm sure if you could produce an overstocked pike water, a self hooking pike rig and a strain of super pike that could be caught over and over again without harm then most of the idiots would be into piking...
As for remotes, the main advantage I've found is when you get a run, most other people on the lake don't know - they are all zipped up in there sleeping bags !!!!!
I wasn't having a go at carp anglers in general, just pointing out that this particular rule may have been brought about by the actions of carp anglers one one water in particular.
Like you say every branch of angling has its share of idiots. I think its just the fact that there is some pretty easy carp fishing available these days for those that want it and this, coupled with the 'self hooking' rigs that, lets face it, bolt rigs are, lends itself well to lazy, p*ssheads so they tend to move into carp angling. Thereby giving the serious guys an undeserved bad name, some of the best specci guys i know used to be carp anglers before they saw the light.....
I'm sure if you could produce an overstocked pike water, a self hooking pike rig and a strain of super pike that could be caught over and over again without harm then most of the idiots would be into piking...
As for remotes, the main advantage I've found is when you get a run, most other people on the lake don't know - they are all zipped up in there sleeping bags !!!!!
R
Ron Clay
Guest
Actually I love to have a couple of days during the summer months camped up by a picturesque lake after tench or bream. I love the outdoor life, the smell of bacon and eggs sizzling in the pan, the onset of dusk when all manner of wildlife is seen, the bleep of the buzzer to the first indications of the interest of a tench. I also like to sit with a good friend as the sun goes down with a beer or whisky together with maybe some intelligent conversation on how to put the world to right.
There is also the excitement as a big fish rolls in the margins or the almost unbeleivable power felt as a big carp screams off into the darkness.
All good stuff and much beloved by your genuine night/long stay angler.
However many of them bivvy up to get away from the missus, or as an excuse the get horribly assoled.
I don't know how they manage to eat those awful curries either. There is absolutley nothing more revolting than curries as they are concieved and cooked in the UK. UUUGGGHH!!!
There is also the excitement as a big fish rolls in the margins or the almost unbeleivable power felt as a big carp screams off into the darkness.
All good stuff and much beloved by your genuine night/long stay angler.
However many of them bivvy up to get away from the missus, or as an excuse the get horribly assoled.
I don't know how they manage to eat those awful curries either. There is absolutley nothing more revolting than curries as they are concieved and cooked in the UK. UUUGGGHH!!!
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Malcolm Bason
Guest
"I don't know how they manage to eat those awful curries either. There is absolutley nothing more revolting than curries as they are concieved and cooked in the UK. UUUGGGHH!!!"
Curries are brilliant Ron - you don't know what you are missing! LOL Mind you, from what I hear, Brummies Balti's are a different matter!
Curries are brilliant Ron - you don't know what you are missing! LOL Mind you, from what I hear, Brummies Balti's are a different matter!
R
Ron Clay
Guest
Look mate I've tried all sorts of curries in the UK. From microwavable packets to some of the best Balti houses in Sheffield, London, Birmingham and Leamington.
I don't know what it is but British created curries are so bad that they are obscene.
I used to love the curries we got in Durban - the best curries in the World!! Next time you are in Durban try the "British and Middle Eastern Sporting Club" or the "Perfumed Garden" in Johannesburg.
Once you have been to these places you are spoiled for anything else in the world and I kid you not!!!! Period!!!!
I don't know what it is but British created curries are so bad that they are obscene.
I used to love the curries we got in Durban - the best curries in the World!! Next time you are in Durban try the "British and Middle Eastern Sporting Club" or the "Perfumed Garden" in Johannesburg.
Once you have been to these places you are spoiled for anything else in the world and I kid you not!!!! Period!!!!
B
Birds Nest
Guest
The trouble with a "Curry" is its a bit Generic, and is used to cover a massive range of dishes...... Start of a new thread me thinks....
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Rob Brownfield
Guest
Best curry i ever ate was a monkey curry, cooked deep in the jungles of Brunei, by a section of Gurkhas! Also had a wild pig on a spit...took 24 hours to gook..and the flesh fell away from the bones.
As for alarms with tranceivers...well..that is open to abuse (seem to recall a well known angler boasting that he was "in the pub" when his alarm on his belt burst into life!)
Sleeping in a bivvie whilst fishing...well..i like many others can quote many instances where anglers have not woken up etc. Worst case was on a syndicate water in Cheshire where I had to run around 200 yards to hit a run in the middle of the night because my buddy in his bivvy was asleep. By the I got there, the fish had run through two of my lines...but I got it in eventually. Even while playing the fish i was shouting at him to wake up. I ended up winding in his rods, and his mates rods next to him.
I am lucky in that I sleep lightly, and I have a good sleeping bag which means I never shut the bivvie door, even in winter. I also sleep with my boots on...(army habit) so i unzip the bag and I am on the rods in seconds.
i guess the answer is to ban night fishing...but I really dont think it will solve anything. However, banning booze will, in my own opinion, be a safety factor...and should be implimented.
Anyone know the legal standings reguarding Public Liability for clubs if a member gets drunk and drowns?
As for alarms with tranceivers...well..that is open to abuse (seem to recall a well known angler boasting that he was "in the pub" when his alarm on his belt burst into life!)
Sleeping in a bivvie whilst fishing...well..i like many others can quote many instances where anglers have not woken up etc. Worst case was on a syndicate water in Cheshire where I had to run around 200 yards to hit a run in the middle of the night because my buddy in his bivvy was asleep. By the I got there, the fish had run through two of my lines...but I got it in eventually. Even while playing the fish i was shouting at him to wake up. I ended up winding in his rods, and his mates rods next to him.
I am lucky in that I sleep lightly, and I have a good sleeping bag which means I never shut the bivvie door, even in winter. I also sleep with my boots on...(army habit) so i unzip the bag and I am on the rods in seconds.
i guess the answer is to ban night fishing...but I really dont think it will solve anything. However, banning booze will, in my own opinion, be a safety factor...and should be implimented.
Anyone know the legal standings reguarding Public Liability for clubs if a member gets drunk and drowns?
A
Andy Nellist
Guest
I remember night fishing 25 years ago before I could afford buzzers. Straining my eyes to watch silver paper indicators and later monkey climbers I often fell asleep to be awakened by my reel handle churning.
My rods would have been better attended if I had had alarms and been asleep.
These days I am often awake and on my rods after just one bleep and before the bite develops. Modern setups ensure you know all about it when you get a bite whether asleep or not.
Being asleep does not adversly affect the rate at which I strike and certainly does not affect the welfare of the fish I am after.
I can see the arguement against sleeping whilst snag fishing and I for one wouldn't do it.
Unattended should mean just that. You should have an effective method of bite detection and be capable of striking the rod within a reasonable time (say 5 seconds when fishing open water immediately when fishing snags).
My rods would have been better attended if I had had alarms and been asleep.
These days I am often awake and on my rods after just one bleep and before the bite develops. Modern setups ensure you know all about it when you get a bite whether asleep or not.
Being asleep does not adversly affect the rate at which I strike and certainly does not affect the welfare of the fish I am after.
I can see the arguement against sleeping whilst snag fishing and I for one wouldn't do it.
Unattended should mean just that. You should have an effective method of bite detection and be capable of striking the rod within a reasonable time (say 5 seconds when fishing open water immediately when fishing snags).
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Paul Williams
Guest
Yeah i remember those days too Andy......and those heron alarms were so unpredictable we dare not sleep in case we missed a fish!!
This is like everything else, a few idiots will spoil it for everyone......yep i've fallen asleep!.....i also like to read whilst on a long session with the buzzers.
Personally i think it is difficult sometimes to be the guy to make the rules.......for instance, those of us who like to fish for three days on a large gravel pit, would we feel it OK to do the same in one swim on a small club river?.....we need comman sense to prevail, problem is comman sense is an endangered species!!!
This is like everything else, a few idiots will spoil it for everyone......yep i've fallen asleep!.....i also like to read whilst on a long session with the buzzers.
Personally i think it is difficult sometimes to be the guy to make the rules.......for instance, those of us who like to fish for three days on a large gravel pit, would we feel it OK to do the same in one swim on a small club river?.....we need comman sense to prevail, problem is comman sense is an endangered species!!!
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Rob Brownfield
Guest
I could not afford Herons....I had to get the BJ bite alarm with that terrible "buzzzzzzzzz"
9 time out of ten the silver paper would rise and the buzzer would just sit there until the line went tight...the first bolt rig maybe?..lol
9 time out of ten the silver paper would rise and the buzzer would just sit there until the line went tight...the first bolt rig maybe?..lol
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Rob Shallcroft
Guest
Sleeping by the rods with good bite indication and alarms i don?t have a problem with. However the practice of turning up the alarms and walking away from the swim is the problem. The practice of carp anglers meeting up in a swim often for long periods whilst listening out for their alarms long distances away should be stopped. Its this type of practice which leads to clubs restricting night fishing not good anglers getting forty winks next to their rods.