If commercials never existed

[rayner]

I think my first thought of fewer anglers without commercials is a strong feeling.
Especially with the very close to an explosion of new and returning older anglers that took almost every peg on local commercials.
In Sheffield we have two fishable rivers, The rivers Don and Rother, there's also the river Sheaf, I class the Sheaf as a stream. It still holds fish.
There are reservoirs Dam Flask, Underbank and Ulley all only a short drive away.
The only reason to mention these waters is the simple fact that virtually the banks are void of anglers. Reservoirs zero anglers with commercial rammed. The lockdowns have earned the commercial owners a good few quid and tackle shops haven't done too badly.
I doubt these returning anglers would start up again without commercials.
Folk now want more bang for their buck, like it or not commercials do it for them.

 

[Badgerale]

Regarding mouth damage:

Carpers blame matchmen.
Matchmen blame carpers.
Some blame barbed hooks.
Some blame barbless.

I'm sure there are bad practices that make it worse than it could be, but if your on a commie where a fish being hauled out again and again, eventually damage will be done no matter what hook you use.

 

[sam vimes]

Carpers blame matchmen.
Matchmen blame carpers.
Some blame barbed hooks.
Some blame barbless.

True enough. However, as I have a finger in all those pies, I'm afraid that I lay the blame squarely at the feet of bad anglers. Sadly, there are far too many of those of all stripes. Some are so bad that they can't even unhook a barbless hook without causing a bloody mess. I've lost count of the number of anglers I've encountered that don't always carry disgorgers and/or forceps.

The only thing that can't be blamed entirely on bad anglers is on fisheries where the fish see the bank umpteen times per week and occasional places where young, soft mouthed stock fish are fished for too soon after stocking.

 

[108831]

Alders has always had rules promoting fish care,but do no kid yourself 300lbs+ in five hours is a real task,in fact only a relative small percentage of anglers fishing there in matches are 'good' enough to get those weights,fish have to be got in the net relatively quickly,quicker than I would prefer if pleasure fishing,dont blame the angler,blame the owner,very high stock levels promote the anglers taking this action to win,if 100lbs was a top winning weight and fish average 3-5lbs it's not a race to achieve it,the fish aren't damaged being unhooked,they are damaged being held,lines cut either side of the mouth,carp fight hard,with match anglers not seeing that they treat fish poorly,if you watch most unhook fish perfectly,better than most pleasure anglers probably,but you cannot have powerful fish being held on lines of 6lbs plus with barbless hooks which during fights move around more than barbed increasing the line damage,barbed hooks are actually better for this,but cause more damage upon unhooking,especially where inexperienced anglers are concerned,each fishery is different,many commercials are not capable of producing 3/500lb winning weights,power to their elbows in my opinion,they do more for fish welfare than places like Alders Farm....please do not forget,I was a match angler and as Alex(silvers) knowsI would have been trying to win if I fished those venues,but like him,I preferred more natural type venues. Be under no illusion a carp angler fishing 15lbs b.s. mainline and strong rods reeling in 6lb carp is an overkill and causes similar damage,it can't not,but these aren't what you would class the best anglers in the main,but not everyone is....

 

[rayner]

It is a fact that bad angling injures fish, any episodes of bad angling I notice are from inexperienced anglers. You can spot them on the bank by their tackle and how they conduct themselves with suspect fishing techniques/casting.
I stay away from matches fished on the venue I fish so can't comment on the anglers fishing matches. There's the tent brigade who fish for big carp in a designated pond for carp, I stay away from those anglers also.
Other anglers from genres I don't have anything to do with are of no interest to me.
Folk can fish how they prefer so long as they leave me to my own devices we will all get along.

 

[silvers]

Alders has always had rules promoting fish care,but do no kid yourself 300lbs+ in five hours is a real task,in fact only a relative small percentage of anglers fishing there in matches are 'good' enough to get those weights,fish have to be got in the net relatively quickly,quicker than I would prefer if pleasure fishing,dont blame the angler,blame the owner,very high stock levels promote the anglers taking this action to win,if 100lbs was a top winning weight and fish average 3-5lbs it's not a race to achieve it,the fish aren't damaged being unhooked,they are damaged being held,lines cut either side of the mouth,carp fight hard,with match anglers not seeing that they treat fish poorly,if you watch most unhook fish perfectly,better than most pleasure anglers probably,but you cannot have powerful fish being held on lines of 6lbs plus with barbless hooks which during fights move around more than barbed increasing the line damage,barbed hooks are actually better for this,but cause more damage upon unhooking,especially where inexperienced anglers are concerned,each fishery is different,many commercials are not capable of producing 3/500lb winning weights,power to their elbows in my opinion,they do more for fish welfare than places like Alders Farm....please do not forget,I was a match angler and as Alex(silvers) knowsI would have been trying to win if I fished those venues,but like him,I preferred more natural type venues. Be under no illusion a carp angler fishing 15lbs b.s. mainline and strong rods reeling in 6lb carp is an overkill and causes similar damage,it can't not,but these aren't what you would class the best anglers in the main,but not everyone is....

I’m really not qualified to comment on commercial fisheries ... I’ve been to two in the last twenty years!
One of those was lindholme, and the lake that I drew on had an “all fish must be netted” rule ... as it was effectively the stock growing on pond with less mature fish with potentially softer mouths?

However, I do have a theory on commercial type lakes ... that they are stocked to appeal to the ”lowest common denominator” quality of angler ... to assure them of a days sport ... whereas such an angler might struggle for a bite on less well stocked venues, they are guaranteed some sport on the “typical” commercial (if there is such a thing).
Naturally, put a group of competent match anglers on such a venue and they empty it!

i also understand that the better commercial anglers have worked out how to get the carp in the net in the shortest possible time by effectively “mugging” them on the first pass. I believe that Will Raison is the master of this ... but of course very few have this level of skill.