Loosing fish River Trent

john step

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This is about the rocks on the river Trent.
I spoke to anglers recently who had lost some barbel to the rocks. They were initially casting over them but still managed the losses.

They had all the Trent typical barbel rods and rests and appeared seasoned barbelers.. On another forum a barbel angler stated he had lost no fewer than 10 recently.

I feel that if you are fishing a spot or with gear that cannot land the barbel then you should move or beef up your gear.
I know losses are inevitable but large numbers of losses are just not fair on the fish.

A while ago on here I was challenged about the beefy gear I used for barbel ON THE TRENT WHERE THE ROCKS ARE ON THE BENDS. I do appreciate there are sections I fish where the bottom is more benign.

My assertion is that the rod and line must have the backbone to get the fish up off the bottom and out of danger.

I was told that I must be winching them in and not playing them. I must say the only tackle you could really winch them in would be that designed for marlin! Or a tractor!

I feel that just because a rod is advertised as a barbel rod that does not automatically mean its up to the job.

Any thoughts anyone?
 

sam vimes

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The initial reason I got into long float rods was largely due to fishing the Trent. I also had 15' Barbel rods just for that river. Even where it isn't full of broken concrete slabs, there is often a fairly dramatic nearside shelf. Depending on the makeup of them, these shelves often aren't as instantly catastrophic, but they can still seriously threaten the integrity of your mainline.
 

nottskev

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Anyone can lose a fish in unforeseen circumstances, but for anyone to lose them regularly and persist with the same tackle or in the same places is a disgrace.

I fished a favourite swim at the start of the season, and found the floods had lodged a large obstacle ( and I do mean large) at the bottom of the shelf making it next to impossible to bring a barbel to the bank. The fish are still there, but I won't fish the swim while it remains like this, and nor will friends who I've told.

It doesn't matter if some people think gear is crude; it's an unforgiving river full of "hard" features, the fish are big these days, and the gear needs to be up to the task. On the Trent, I use 12lb line as a general rule, and 15lb when fishing near snags. The 12lb goes with a 1.75lb rod; the 15lb on a 2lb snag and flood rod. It's not as if using adequate gear stops the barbel trying to pull you in, so there's no argument for more "sporting" lighter gear that will lose fish. There are some swims where you can get away with say 8lb on the float, but you have to keep an open mind on that.

There's a free stretch of the Soar nearby. The river is wildly overgrown and full of rocks. The first time I tried it, I lost a barbel that cut me off on the rocks. I found out that the most allegedly abrasion-resistant braid was Kryston Quicksilver at 25lb. It looks like Orange string. That got the next one out ok, but I gave up on the place after that. The rest of the orange string - all bar about 15" - is still in a drawer somewhere. There are some swims that should just be left alone.
 
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flightliner

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Each specie in the river chooses to reside in a location that suits its needs and Barbel will generally opt for the odd snag or an area where food is more readily available.
It's not unreasonable to use a more robust set up to avoid any loss of a fish in the snaggier areas , a possibly lighter one in places less so.
It's down to the anglers assessment of the river bottom where a kwik pull back of a bottom lead should give the information required , then a setup that's suitable for the area.
There are some mitigating factors on occasions tho, particularly on the Tidal reaches when the river is in flood. I know one swim that's a flyer with a big flood , no tackle losses at all but as the level drops the pace increases and as Nottskev says it's best left alone as it turns into a snagpit.
 

Philip

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I dont know the Trent but sometimes just a change of position can solve the issue. I recall one swim on the Wye that was basically a fallen tree over an undercut bank. Everyone would try and fish it from an upstream position casting downstream to the snag and it was a recipie for getting snagged and losing fish. However if you went downstream and upstreamed it you could fish it without a problem.
 

john step

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Kev, I am glad you mentioned 15lb bs. for those difficult places. That was what I was taken to task about on a past occasion. I also use a couple of carp rods with this higher rated line. The barbel still put a healthy bend in them.
I can and do use 8lb bs on a heavy long distance feeder rod on another spot where I have yet to encounter a snag and a longish cast is necessary as its on the outside of a bend. To be honest I prefer this sort of place.
 

theartist

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I dont know the Trent but sometimes just a change of position can solve the issue. I recall one swim on the Wye that was basically a fallen tree over an undercut bank. Everyone would try and fish it from an upstream position casting downstream to the snag and it was a recipie for getting snagged and losing fish. However if you went downstream and upstreamed it you could fish it without a problem.
I was going to mention this, as a float angler who often fishes mid river I get fish out of swims that sometimes break anglers from the bank on much heavier lines due to the angle I'm fishing at. Granted not everyone can fish mid river and not everywhere can you do this. Maybe the best thing an angler can do when they lose the first fish is think whether they could have done better rather than could the gear, if the answer is no then step up, but how far do you step up? That's the ethical question.

I for one am fed up with my float catching on line left in the water that is like rope. End of the day there's no line that can cope with rocks and trees on the bottom, barbless hooks get ejected from lost fish pretty quick but snagged line stays on the bottom for ages
 
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john step

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I dont know the Trent but sometimes just a change of position can solve the issue. I recall one swim on the Wye that was basically a fallen tree over an undercut bank. Everyone would try and fish it from an upstream position casting downstream to the snag and it was a recipie for getting snagged and losing fish. However if you went downstream and upstreamed it you could fish it without a problem.
Philip, The Trent is a bit of a one off. The lower part is the bit I fish. If you could imagine a very wide canal with high flood banks either side. This is particularly true of the Tidal below Collingham weir. It gets wider and the banks get slushier with mud further downstream.

Its not straight like a canal however. It has large sweeping bends. The current would wash the adjoining land away on the inside of bends if no preventative measures were taken.

The prevention is in the form of large numbers of rocks on the bends. They go out into the river for some yards. Fish love them, tackle doesn't!
 

valetudoguy

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This is about the rocks on the river Trent.
I spoke to anglers recently who had lost some barbel to the rocks. They were initially casting over them but still managed the losses.

They had all the Trent typical barbel rods and rests and appeared seasoned barbelers.. On another forum a barbel angler stated he had lost no fewer than 10 recently.

I feel that if you are fishing a spot or with gear that cannot land the barbel then you should move or beef up your gear.
I know losses are inevitable but large numbers of losses are just not fair on the fish.

A while ago on here I was challenged about the beefy gear I used for barbel ON THE TRENT WHERE THE ROCKS ARE ON THE BENDS. I do appreciate there are sections I fish where the bottom is more benign.

My assertion is that the rod and line must have the backbone to get the fish up off the bottom and out of danger.

I was told that I must be winching them in and not playing them. I must say the only tackle you could really winch them in would be that designed for marlin! Or a tractor!

I feel that just because a rod is advertised as a barbel rod that does not automatically mean its up to the job.

Any thoughts anyone?
Ted Carter of Preston had the best Barbel rods in the country (IMO) made for them by Harrison. Their summer rod was light and very responsive with a lovely playing action. The Winter rod is powerful, yet still responsive and a wonderful playing action.

The winter rod is so good that for me at least it does the job I would have wanted from the Summer and there was no need for both. Yet some times people would respond in the negative when they asked what rod I was using and I told them the Ted Carter Winter Rod.

They would say, “but it isn’t storm conditions, shouldn’t you be using a lighter rod?”

I would just reply that it was all the rod I need.
 

S-Kippy

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As a general principle to fish any swim or method where you are unlikely to be able to land any fish you hook is just bad angling. It matters not one whit what tackle you use provided it is man enough to do the job....if it isn't and you have nothing to "step up" to then I agree with John...the only thing any half decent angler can do is move.

We all get done occasionally but anyone losing fish after fish without doing anything about it is missing the point by some distance.
 

john step

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As a general principle to fish any swim or method where you are unlikely to be able to land any fish you hook is just bad angling. It matters not one whit what tackle you use provided it is man enough to do the job....if it isn't and you have nothing to "step up" to then I agree with John...the only thing any half decent angler can do is move.

We all get done occasionally but anyone losing fish after fish without doing anything about it is missing the point by some distance.
Yes, that was my point exactly.

Edited. I just realised I might have made an error with the title . I think it should be Losing not loosing???
 

nottskev

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Yes, that was my point exactly.

Edited. I just realised I might have made an error with the title . I think it should be Losing not loosing???
Don't worry - you're pretty safe from grammar Nazis on here. It's one of those words. There are some words that always raise a tinge of doubt, just as you're writing. I've looked up a few - like exaggerate and committee - more than once, but I wouldn't rule out having to check again.
 

Rich P

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Very much agree with S-kippy on this issue. Using tackle suited to the conditions is really a minimum requirement for any competent angler. Ignore the negative comments, John. Some barbel anglers use 15lb mono in much more benign situations. Personally, I avoid the rivers where that kind of tackle is required, preferring more intimate rivers and lighter tackle.
 

flightliner

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I never forgot a remark made by a match angler who was fishing opposite to me on the Tidal Trent back in the early nineties when I was heavily into the Barbel.
He had drawn well but despite having plenty of bites was failing on each occasion to stay connected to his fish which were Barbel.
It was obvious by his remarks that came drifting over the river that his frustration was mounting when he said " they'll never believe me back on the Witham that I'm using four pound line" !
 
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