Pellet quantities fed....

theartist

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THREE KILOS Rob,three pints I can understand,i've carried three kilos down the river,one of 4mm,one of 6mm and one of 8mm,never with the intention of feeding them all,just in case I wanted to vary it a bit...
ALso,dont forget the minnows,it's amazing to me,i've never caught one there,but i've watched small shoals down the side,giving the pellet a good rogering.... :)
Sorry yeah three kilos that's really going for it, that must be a good ten pints when you think how a 750g bag fills a bait tub. On a positive note I managed to jinx it by saying I never get in a flyer swim in summer as have just got back from there now, my scenario slightly mirrors yours as I went in a vacated swim where the guy wasn't catching much. Not sure what he fed but I'm guessing it wasn't enough as they having it per the usual after a few runs through, got through around a pint feeding every cast till It was time to let a couple of lads who had come up from Maidstone have a go. The fish are looking well and really loving this extra water.

Really high yet pretty clear, plus a smashing lake to wade through to get there too which I've never seen before ;)
 

Philip

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Lots of bait or just a little ?

...Of course it depends on lots of factors such as the venue, stock, other anglers etc but I am going to appear the odd one out here as I have been throwing in a measured 3 and half kilos every day into the river at the moment for days on end.

I should point out these are not specifically pellets but a mixture of particles and harder baits. Approx 1 Kilo of the hard stuff and 2.5 Kilos of the particles. The only reason its not all pellets is simply down to cost. I have no doubt whatsoever if it was all pellets it would work just as well, maybe even better …so if someone wants to give me a load for free I will happily wear the tee shirt ;-) haha..

Joking aside I usually bait a few hours before fishing & I usually get bites within minutes of casting in which tells me that the majority of my bait must already be gone. Its also been noticeable that on too many occasions to be a coincidence the first fish of the session has been the biggest. This tells me there is some very confident feeding going on out there, everything wants the bait and the bigger ones are pushing aside the smaller ones to get at it first & Barbel are amongst the fish I am catching.

On a small river like the one in question, I doubt I would dream of throwing that much in. However using allot of bait can also be devastating as well at times.

I recall a light bulb moment some years ago when I used to prebait for Carp allot on the river. I was fishing short sessions of just 2 or 3 hours each time & I always baited after fishing, scared that I would be over baiting and the fish would not find the hookbait. Then one day I decided to pile it all in at the start and sat back convinced I had blown it but then had two rods go off at the same time within 30mins of casting out.

The chances that BOTH fish had been unlucky enough to pick up the hookbaits amongst all the free offerings was literally impossible to happen. Far more likely is that a large group of fish was moving in as the bait went in and clearing me out.

So yes sparse baiting can be good but the fishing world is full of examples of how successful big baiting can be too. Ok not specifically Barbel but for example Jim Shelly when he went onto Conningbrook & filled it in when everyone was saying it had to be just single hookbaits and he caught the big one in literally no time at all. Another example from even further back was when some of the Tenchfishers went onto the Kent pits. They were piling in layers mash laced with allot of bait and absolutely took it apart. I cant recall the guys name but he was in the angling press almost weekly with these amazing catches of Tench.

I don’t see Barbel as being that different to anything else, they want food and if you give them a regular supply without too many ill side effects (such as being hooked too often) then they will have it. Of course the make up of the bait also needs to be considered, for example the colder the water the more easily digestible the bait should be else it could end up counterproductive & so on…there are lots of permutations.

All that said there is no doubt a single hookbait in splendid isolation will also catch fish if you put it in the right place. :)
 

theartist

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Nice post Phillip I would go as far as saying getting feeding right is the most important skill to hone

Mind you I think selfishly I want other anglers to feed more so those gudgeon get bigger, then there could be a Sherman MkII, I miss Sherman and still think about how she got so fat on our freebies, whilst keeping her curves of course. If more bait had gone in she wouldn't have died trying to swallow that cormorant.
 

budsy

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I tend to notice its the North of Britain which tends to be the best parts for fishing , having been around the UK as a whole the lucky sods.
 

whitty

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I can understand putting in large quantities of particles,seeds,they are less filling in the main and tend to pass through the fishes gut quickly promoting a feeding response,pellets(especially halibuts)are very oily,and difficult to digest in cooler water,with breakdown being pretty slow at that time too,so feeding needs to be worked with that in mid imo,good anglers never have a set feeding regime,nor should they,the fish don't...
 

theartist

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You'll still see the odd bit of overfeeding in winter and think whoah but on the whole 99% will tone down their feeding after the frosts. Those fish there have thrived for decades despite a constant angling presence which must be credited to the club and the vast majority of anglers. Lets face it Alan they are more at threat from something being washed in from your lovely town during the floods :D
 

whitty

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Absolutely,not really thinking of a threat from the pellet,more as being highly detrimental to the fishing itself...
 

silvers

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Match anglers perspective:

3 kilos of pellets on a small brook like that is nuts, even If you catch you’ve probably filled up the fish for the next day or 5!

I fish for barbel in matches on the warks Avon, Severn, Wye and Trent and have never used more than 3/4 of a bag of pellets in a 5 hour match. Most of that is feeder fishing with medium kamasan black caps.
equally 8mm pellet as feed? On the most heavily matched up parts of the Severn (bewdley and bridgnorth) 8mm is hookbait for red letter days only these days. Feed is 3mm and hookbait 4 or 6mm.

As Philip’s post and others have said ... the thing is to think about your feeding and what you’re trying to achieve, rather than just slavishly following fashion or habit. Experimentation on feeding and presentation is surely the key to consistent success?
 

Keith M

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As a rule I rarely use pellets for beards once the water temperatures have started to plummet, although during a mildish winter period I do use a few small pellets in a short length of pvc stocking but only in small amounts.

Instead I tend to use non fatty and spicey flavoured meat baits and or more natural hook baits like a couple of redworm or a bunch of maggots.

If I'm using spice flavoured meat I occasionally coat it in a soft dissolving crab paste or Active8 paste or something similar to provide a nice flavour trail downstream and this works for me even on the coldest of days.

Another hook bait I'm going to try this winter for beards is some non oily and semi soft Spicey sausage flavoured baits that I've found in my tackle shop that are designed to ooze out a nice flavour trail downstream as they slowly disolve (see pic); they look like they might fit the bill perfectly, they might not work but I'm going to give them a try, so watch this space ;)



Keith
 
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whitty

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Feeding a mixture of pellets is my method of choice where fishing pellet is concerned,feeding exclusively small pellet can and does preoccupy barbel,as does excessive feeding of hemp,also feeding smaller pellet allows small fish to eat them in one hit,not ideal imo,also dry 2/3/4mm pellets have a tendency to a certain amount floating(even halibuts),also not ideal,dampening them creates bouyancy,again not ideal,as you can seen i've given this a bit of thought over the years,not just barbel wise,so ensuring you feed the right pellets is worth spending time sorting out,as i've said before,I believe trout pellet to be superior to halibuts and carp pellets,but quantities need to be carefully thought out,regularity also needs to be eeked out to achieve the best results,mistakes will be made,cos we all make em...
 

whitty

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On an off topic tack for a moment,a mate gave me a heads up for some new pellets,I thought i'd give em a try,so ordered some on Friday afternoon,turned out after i'd payed for them and returned to the site I'd bought the wrong ones,I tried ringing but got a poxy answerphone,emailed,no reply and they were closed till monday,tried ringing on the monday,same result,so rang my mate,who gave me another guy I knows number who is sponsored by the company,he emailed the boss and on tuesday afternoon I had a phone call straightening everything out??? Had to pay £7.50 more as the pellets I wanted were dearer,the guy said they would get here by the end of the week,yesterday I had an email saying my order had left the factory and to expect it today,thing was the order details were for the incorrect order I made initially,this morning I rang phone banking and the £7.50 had not been taken,nor was pending,at 10.45am a courier pulled up and carried a box to my door,he said it was one of two,the other should arrive tomorrow,now upon opening I could not tell whether this was what I'd ordered or not,apart from the fact I'd ordered two bags 2.5k each of different flavoured 10mm pellets,one bag looked right,the other was a 2.5k bag of mixed sizes,so where were my other pellets,will they come tomorrow,or is this it,nothing written on the bags to say what size,or flavour,i've rang all afternoon,just the answer phone,and emailed,nothing,what a bloody shambles....
 

tigger

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Hell of a lot of aggro for a few pellets ?.
 

whitty

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Well it probably wouldn't have been if this senile old git would have ordered correctly originally online Ian,they smell the 'dogs' and must be good for hookbaits(hair baits),which is what my mates are saying down in Christchurch...
 

tigger

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Regarding things that smell good to us smelling to good fish also, i'm not so sure about that.
I mean, most fish will home in on a scent of worms and yet they smell of next to nowt to me. Fish also go for chopped up old fish (chum) and yet it smells ransid to me.
I'm not convinced that the smells we like are attractive to fish.
 

Aknib

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I'm not convinced that the smells we like are attractive to fish.

I'm of that school of thought too Ian, if anyone has ever had a whiff of eel oil which some Pike anglers inject into their deadbaits they'd think the same... It smells like something you'd normally be scraping off the underside of your shoe.

I've still got a jar and I can't bare to take the lid off the damned stuff! :poop:
 

whitty

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Didn't quite intend it to be took that way,I wouldn't want to be in a locked room with them,spicy sausage,the other squid don't do much for me,but there is a good amount of flavour there...
 

Keith M

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I'm not convinced that the smells we like are attractive to fish.

I bought some 'sea food' liquid flavouring for my home made carp boilees one lunchtime and I made the mistake of opening it in the office, and it stunk out the office and all you needed was the sound of sea gulls and you could close your eyes and imagine standing on the beach at Hastings amongst rotting sea weed and crabs.
The rest of the people in the office were not amused.

Keith
 

whitty

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Belechan is the worst stink i've smelt,I kept the brick in a sealed plastic bag,in a screw up glass jar,then into a boiled sweet jar,still stunk,threw the bugger out eventually,couldn't possibly use it,my missus would've locked me out...
 

dorsetsteve

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Match anglers perspective:

3 kilos of pellets on a small brook like that is nuts, even If you catch you’ve probably filled up the fish for the next day or 5!

I fish for barbel in matches on the warks Avon, Severn, Wye and Trent and have never used more than 3/4 of a bag of pellets in a 5 hour match. Most of that is feeder fishing with medium kamasan black caps.
equally 8mm pellet as feed? On the most heavily matched up parts of the Severn (bewdley and bridgnorth) 8mm is hookbait for red letter days only these days. Feed is 3mm and hookbait 4 or 6mm.

As Philip’s post and others have said ... the thing is to think about your feeding and what you’re trying to achieve, rather than just slavishly following fashion or habit. Experimentation on feeding and presentation is surely the key to consistent success?

Interesting reply, and food for thought. I’ve noticed that going the other way can help to. A few years back I noted that the Barbel would not respond to the 4/6mm pellet sizes I was using, I had some 13mm ones kicking about, instant response.
 
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