Rod Material Evolution......

Notts Michael.

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I vaguely remember Jack Hargreaves in 'Old Country' on the telly in the 80's but wouldn't have been that bothered in the programs as a 10 or so year old.
I found this one from 1983 on youtube recently and found it very interesting, showing (in the first half) some different rod materials, up to the 'new fangled' Carbon Fibre!

YouTube


I'm sure there is a lot of Jack Hargreaves and similar Country matters type programs influence in The Fast Show's Bob Fleming :D
 

s63

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I vaguely remember Jack Hargreaves in 'Old Country' on the telly in the 80's but wouldn't have been that bothered in the programs as a 10 or so year old.
I found this one from 1983 on youtube recently and found it very interesting, showing (in the first half) some different rod materials, up to the 'new fangled' Carbon Fibre!

YouTube


I'm sure there is a lot of Jack Hargreaves and similar Country matters type programs influence in The Fast Show's Bob Fleming :D
No doubt influenced by Paul Whitehouse.
 

xenon

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Love Jack-easily the most laid back presenter on telly, by a country mile. Fair bit of his stuff on youtube.
 

Keith M

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Whatever happened to the Carrot fibre rods that was once deemed as the next rod material to Carbon fibre?

Keith
 

peterjg

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I grew up using a whole cane float rod - horrible really. Also tried greenheart rod tips (awful)

then

a wholecane rod with a solid fibreglass tip section - bit better

then

a built cane rod - horrible heavy, spongy

then

a selection of different hollow glass rods - vastly better, those horrible brass ferrules soon disappeared with spigots or overfit joints instead, hollow glass rods were becoming really good then carbon appeared

then up to present

more than a few carbon fibre rods. Most modern carbon rods are superb compared to built cane. Why there is still an interest in using crappy built cane is beyond me?
 

markg

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I think when we were kids we only had cheap crappy cane rods. Now we are older and have a few bob we can afford decent ones. Overinflated prices and old they may be but they are still good rods and some argue better in some ways than carbon rods. I have held or fished with some of those very good cane rods and they were nothing like those cheap crappy things that were usually fostered on us by hard up dads
It might be the same for modern rods today in the future when some new material is the norm. The crappy carbon ones will be history but the really good ones might be sought after still. It’s the same with most things when you think about it, cars, records, art etc.
Back to Jack Hargreaves, he was a delightful presenter, he was like valium.
 

steve2

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I grew up using a whole cane float rod - horrible really. Also tried greenheart rod tips (awful)

then

a wholecane rod with a solid fibreglass tip section - bit better

then

a built cane rod - horrible heavy, spongy

then

a selection of different hollow glass rods - vastly better, those horrible brass ferrules soon disappeared with spigots or overfit joints instead, hollow glass rods were becoming really good then carbon appeared

then up to present

more than a few carbon fibre rods. Most modern carbon rods are superb compared to built cane. Why there is still an interest in using crappy built cane is beyond me?
I followed the same path but still do have a couple of cane rods.
The same sort of path can be followed by my reels. From boys reels, cheap and cheerful bakelite through to today state of the art reels.
There are still those that prefer using old rods and reels but give me modern tackle any day.

Jack Hargreaves TV programmes still can be watched through Rose tinted glasses. Memories of what we thought were the good old days.
 

sam vimes

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I couldn't care less about what other people might choose to use for fishing. I'll use whatever I think best for the job in hand, or whatever brings me the most enjoyment. For me, that revolves around floatfishing, often with long rods and invariably with a centrepin (if I'm fishing flowing water). I have no interest in vintage gear, of any description, unless it's better than anything else available. The closest I get to using vintage gear is Abu closed face reels. My legering gear is going to qualify as vintage sooner or later as I won't even bother to update/upgrade it. For the amount of use it gets, it's perfectly adequate. I have just one fibreglass rod lurking somewhere. The first rod I ever used. I've seen some really bad carbon rods over the years that I'd prefer to use. I wouldn't know a good cane rod if you spanked my backside with it. However, I've never picked one up that could be considered to be light. For that reason alone, I'm uninterested in cane rods.
 

nottskev

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I just saw the tail-end of the pre-carbon rods. When I started fishing, the older kids who let me tag along to the canal had glass rods. The two kids who took it most seriously had Mordex and Milbro rods. They all seemed to have an old cane rod or two in the shed, hand-me-downs from dads or grandads who'd mostly given it up. I used to be allowed to borrow one of these, and I caught my first few fish with a bit of line tied to the end of a 9' cane rod. One lad had a posh cane rod, a very different beast to the shed remnants. It was surprisingly light and had a springy, unexpectedly "live" feel if you waggled it. Maybe that feel is what the retro dudes rave about? I don't know, as that was the last time I held a cane rod.

I had a few glass rods over the next years: a Sealey Blue Match (lovely soft tip), a B+W CTM 12' ( respected make but horrible action), a Shakespeare International (came with a cracked joint, so I claimed a refund) and, my favourite in glass, a Shakespeare Sigma Canal which I used so much I re-ringed it twice. I also had a couple of leger rods made by the East Anglian Rod Co - they were fine, and no big issue with weight at 9' or 10'.

The first carbon rods I met were a revelation. But they were pricey, and cost £100+ in the early 80's. They were by no means all great - the first one I splashed out on - a handsome B+W jet-black creation - proved too stiff and powerful for any of the fishing I did, and I swapped it for a Sundridge Kevin Ashurst, much better for light lines. The step-change from glass to carbon was huge, and even thought the weights have been shaved down and designs improved, there haven't been any comparable new developments.
 

markg

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I think the best development from cane to solid glass to carbon was in beach casters. None of the fore mentioned materials could compare, they just didn’t suit the job needed i.e. to cast big weights a long way. The only time I enjoyed a solid glass rod was in a boat rod. I hated those 6ft solid sticks that were the norm back then and had a 8ft solid glass rod that had a bit of give in it and I would be fishing just outside of the anglers sitting in the boat with me with there 6ft rods.
Nothing wrong with carbon for coarse fishing, all the rods I use at the moment are carbon and the lightness of them was a boon but I still like the look and feel of a good cane rod. A good cane rod is not heavy as such; a cork handle is nice and I always find all synthetic rods a bit too springy. I have never found one that replicates the softer springyness of split cane. Maybe the very expensive ones do which I have never tried. It does not makle much difference really but when I spring a cane rod back from 90 degrees; I find the way it springs back more pleasing than a carbon rod.
 
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seth49

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Don’t mind using a cane rod occasionally, have it on a rest the weight doesn’t matter, I have a Edgar Sealy rover ten foot split cane rod, which I sometimes use with a pin close in, don’t feel handicapped with it at all, I’ve had carp to eight pounds on it no problem, and I seem to hook more bites with it as well.

Certainly better than the first fibre glass rod I bought, that was rubbish, but rods today are far better than than when I started fishing back in the early sixties , you can get a perfectly usable rod now from thirty pounds upwards, I’ve greys, Shimano, maver and Korum rods all of which are a pleasure to use, don’t think I’ve paid more than a hundred and thirty for a new rod, and most quite a bit cheaper.
 

steve2

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Having used rods built from every type of material, Greenheart through to modern carbons I don’t expect to see any future development in my lifetime.
May be with green issues we will see a swing back to natural materials and cane will make a come back.
 

nottskev

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I know this is not the most pole-infested forum, and some won't be bothered one way or the other, but it's worth saying that the coming of carbon for rods transformed the world of pole fishing. Glass wasn't viable beyond 6 or 7 m. The first carbon pole I owned was hard work at 10m. The poles I use these days, both the light one and the margin pole, are light enough at that length to comfortably rest on your knee or strike with one hand on them, and neither belongs to the latest generations. So that's one branch of fishing that wasn't just improved, it was made possible by carbon.
 

sam vimes

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I know this is not the most pole-infested forum, and some won't be bothered one way or the other, but it's worth saying that the coming of carbon for rods transformed the world of pole fishing. Glass wasn't viable beyond 6 or 7 m. The first carbon pole I owned was hard work at 10m. The poles I use these days, both the light one and the margin pole, are light enough at that length to comfortably rest on your knee or strike with one hand on them, and neither belongs to the latest generations. So that's one branch of fishing that wasn't just improved, it was made possible by carbon.
I rather think that rods are little different. You don't see many cane (coarse) rods in excess of 11', even float rods. You don't see too many glass rods in excess of 13'. Whilst I accept that many choose not to use them, 15'+ carbon rods are perfectly useable. The prospect of a 15' glass or cane rod fills me with horror. Though the rise of short commercial fishery rods has skewed things, rods have tended to get longer as materials improved and the use of those materials develops over time.
 

steve2

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You don't see too many glass rods in excess of 13'.
I did have a pricey 14ft Bruce and Walker CTM which looking back when compared to modern rods was not very good.
Agree with the pole comments carbon made long pole fishing so much easier.
 

nottskev

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Yes, of course, we owe the long rods we use these days to carbon. I have a few myself, including a Tricast 17' from the turn of the century. I was thinking more of the way carbon opened up pole fishing well beyond 10m - a whole new ball game impossible before - whereas longer rods added - usefully and enjoyably - to styles we were already using; a choice rather than a necessity.
 

Keith M

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Having used rods built from every type of material, Greenheart through to modern carbons I don’t expect to see any future development in my lifetime.
May be with green issues we will see a swing back to natural materials and cane will make a come back.
When I mentioned ‘Carrot fibre’ earlier I was not joking, it was being discussed in its early stages by engineers back in 2007 and it was not an April fools joke either, here’s an article of news referring to this on the Herald newspaper:

Why your next fishing rod could be made of carrots | HeraldScotland

It certainly doesn’t appear to have progressed a lot although I have read elsewhere about a couple of fly rods that were made out of carrot fibre.

Does anyone have any more info regards Carrot fibre fishing rods? or was it (as I suspect) not such a breakthrough as it was first thought?

Keith
 
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