Why use braid mainline?

[Steve Arnold]

This will not be news to many anglers, but after a recent curt put down by one angler I gave some gentle polite advice to, when he was striking ineffectually after a bite at range in a strong current, I thought it worth putting my thinking down here.

For me (super) braid has transformed my fishing and success! Since the first time I used it over 25 years ago, and caught a porbeagle shark of nearly 260 lbs, I have used it for almost all my fishing shore, boat and river.

I do not choose my braid by breaking strain but by diameter. Now I almost exclusively fish a big river with bottom baits I find a braid of about .21 mm diameter is most useful but will drop to .19 or go up to .24 where big fish in the snags might be the target. Do not ask me about breaking strains as the manufacturers quote ridiculous figures. All I know is what knot strengths I achieve and that these lines cast much easier than equivalent BS mono.

The main advantage quoted by nearly everyone is braids lack of stretch, so important when fishing at greater distances. In tidal waters and in strong river flows the combination of little stretch and finer diameter allows the use of smaller weights to hold bottom..........and the bite detection is so immensely better with braid than when using mono!

With mono many bites, taking feet of line, will go unseen on the rod tip and the fish will often drop the hook before the angler strikes. At distances other than very short range the fish will have hooked itself and be running (through the snags?) before the angler knows what is happening. The fish can have made a huge bow in the stretchy mono before the angler picks up his rod, that bow often pulled through every snag and weed bed within many yards.

Using braid the angler can be fishing at 100 yds and have almost immediate contact with the taking fish, the fish being hooked against the instant resistance of the rod. There will be minimal bow in the braid line whichever way the fish runs due to its fine diameter, BONUS....braid slices through soft weed like a hot knife through butter!

I found this video on YouTube that should be an eye-opener for those reluctant to try braid.....

There are some anglers who try braid and cannot get on with it. Mono has its shortcomings but we have learnt to live with that, I guess. So, if that is you, then all good!

But where big fish in bad rivers are your target, I would bet mono would lose many more fish than would be the case using braid.

Without the customary rubber boat to help follow the fish downriver most of my hooked carp would never have met me.......

.....and all because I did not have a big enough reel to fish the usual mono used for porbeagle shark fishing. I could get over 600 yds of 55 lb Dynon braid on quite a small lever drag Shimano, rather than use one of the big, expensive Penn International reels used by the other guys at that time.

 

[mikench]

I accept what you say Steve but on one of my clubs card and on all its 25 waters braid is banned both as to main line and hook length. On another clubs waters a few are also subject to the braid ban. On a third a similar ban applies to quite a few and one one even legering is also banned. As a consequence I hardly ever use braid usually if pike fishing or using a lure. Unfortunately the waters Gordon and I frequent the most have the braid ban. I rarely river fish but remain full of good intentions.

 

[Steve Arnold]

No doubt I would happily fish with mono in those circumstances Mike.

In well stocked small waters I can imagine braid might cause damage to fish the line pulls across under tension. The fishery owners are quite right tp protect what can be an expensive investment.

Just glad I fish natural waters where the fish are not crowded and I have the whole river to myself most of the time! At least it seems that way apart from July and August.

 

[Ray Roberts]

I use braid for all of my lure fishing and it’s far superior to mono for that. I haven’t used it for feeder fishing but I’ve a mind to give it a try. I have never seen any damage caused to a fish I have caught through using braided mainline.

 

[John Aston]

Just stumbled across this, camouflaged by a blizzard of reviews by Scuba Chris on products I'll never use...

Anyway ...braid . I was introduced to it by a fishing friend about 20 years ago and I use it extensively. For - all lure fishing except ultra light , when even light braid doesn't seem to cast as well as nylon. For all other lure work I use Power Pro, Sick or J Braid

I use it also for long range feeder fishing (using Preston's excellent sinking feeder braid ) and when chub fishing deep, powerful rivers like the Yorkshire Ouse . The only caveat to that is that if using a very short hook length(under 10" ) it is essential to use a shock leader . A foot extra of heavier line is fine but without it , crack offs on the strike can happen . They did to me, and I thought they were bite offs as there was no resistance on the strike but what happens is all the energy of the strike is transmitted down the non stretch braid to the nylon or fluoro hook length and it can part instantly .

All my barbel fishing - which is nearly always in high water , with big leads.

I far prefer it to nylon and am at a loss to understand why some clubs ban it . Apart from the fact that clubs like banning stuff. I have caught hundreds of fish on braid , from roach and chub to big barbel, perch of all sizes and pike to 20+ I have never seen any harm caused by it .

 

[seth49]

I’ve been a fan of braid for years, started using it for bait fishing and spinning for game fish, mainly sea trout and salmon, when I fished for them on the ribble, before the numbers of fish declined significantly around ten years ago, and it wasn’t worth the expense anymore.

i used to float fish shrimps for salmon, and braid was brilliant for that, the braid floated and was easy to mend, to keep in touch with float, and quick to strike as well, which was needed sometimes.

i use it now mainly for feeder and tip fishing for coarse fish, as the bites are a lot better to see, also use it for floater fishing for carp.

one of the waters has a braid ban, and I’ve been using a low stretch mono from Nu fish, which is very good and is similar to braid in use, its called detexion and I like it, also the breaking strain of this line is quoted as knot strength, which is better, I’ve had quite a few double figure carp on 6lb line no problem.

 

[Steve Arnold]

Just stumbled across this, camouflaged by a blizzard of reviews by Scuba Chris on products I'll never use...

Anyway ...braid . I was introduced to it by a fishing friend about 20 years ago and I use it extensively. For - all lure fishing except ultra light , when even light braid doesn't seem to cast as well as nylon. For all other lure work I use Power Pro, Sick or J Braid

I use it also for long range feeder fishing (using Preston's excellent sinking feeder braid ) and when chub fishing deep, powerful rivers like the Yorkshire Ouse . The only caveat to that is that if using a very short hook length(under 10" ) it is essential to use a shock leader . A foot extra of heavier line is fine but without it , crack offs on the strike can happen . They did to me, and I thought they were bite offs as there was no resistance on the strike but what happens is all the energy of the strike is transmitted down the non stretch braid to the nylon or fluoro hook length and it can part instantly .

All my barbel fishing - which is nearly always in high water , with big leads.

I far prefer it to nylon and am at a loss to understand why some clubs ban it . Apart from the fact that clubs like banning stuff. I have caught hundreds of fish on braid , from roach and chub to big barbel, perch of all sizes and pike to 20+ I have never seen any harm caused by it .

Hi John, glad I am not the only one who uses braid almost 100%, I think many anglers worry about the supposed "negatives" too much to recognise just how useful braid is!

Most of my hooklengths are braid now as I found mono and fluoro got cut on the take too often. I have never broken on the strike yet but that first few feet of line taken by a hooked fish is often around a rock and mono has no chance. The river Lot has been "tamed" by man using barrages and weirs, there are so many broken rocks with ragged edges it's like the river bed has serrated blades growing! Even when I fish well away from the weirs my bait will often be under cliffs, so you can imagine what the snags are like!.....

Even the calm water where this photo was taken is full of rocks, the lock entrance and built up bank under the road has left plenty of debris in the river.

Takes are brutal on this tackle, but I have had a few 20lb+ carp recently on what is basically barbel gear. Maybe the tackle I use lacks a sporting approach (in some anglers eyes!) but it's exciting fishing and the first run of a good fish certainly gets some adrenaline flowing through my heart!

For hook-lengths I use ESP Tungsten loaded coated braid in the worst of it, never been cut yet! Where I feel something a little thinner is required I am now trying Nash Skinlink 15lb, seems tough though the coating was a little scraped after one of those recent carp.

I have had quite a few carp run my mainline across branches, often dragging for long distances. So far the braid mainlines have not been cut and I have drawn the fish back without damage to the line. Mono does not stand that sort of abuse for more than seconds, not with that pressure from a big fish and river flow!

That forum "member" who has flooded this section with adverts should be chucked off! He is now on my "ignored members" list and this forum section is almost empty

 

[John Aston]

I have to admit that the scenery you have on the Lot does tend to make my beloved Ouse look awfully dull . All I get this time of year is a slow brown river running through monochrome , misty and flat fields. And you've got cliffs , hilltop villages and rather better wine than is cultivated in the Vale of York ....

 

[nottskev]

It's clear lots of anglers find braid meets their needs better than mono. But I'm not one of them, and though I've tried braid for fishing a few times - feeder fishing for bream at 50/60 yards, spinning for pike and perch, trotting a float - I don't have any spools with braid on just now. I wouldn't rule out using it should it prove to be the answer to some situation, but none such has arisen yet.

For the various types of fishing I do: it's useless for pole fishing, so that takes care of that; I'm under a lure fishing curse that means casting one out is tantamount to waving it goodbye, but when lures snagged I was surprised to find how easily strong braid broke with "shock" pulls; with feeder fishing, which I've done lots of but steer away from these days, I never felt I was failing to detect bites and find a degree of stretch (when you know your mono lines you can select this) helpful in avoiding breaking off on the strike or in playing fish, big or small; with float fishing, unless you were wading/trotting straight down from the rod tip, the braid's tendency to waft about, lift off the water and do its own thing made it a poor second for fishing out and across. I disliked the way the rod "banged" when playing fish, and, with the braids I tried at least, it was impossible to put shot on them, make float rubbers or indeed anything else grip on them. Always needing to tie on mono leaders or step down leaders and hooklengths was a faff when you wanted to quickly re-rig, or really just wanted to tie a hook on the end of the line, as sometimes fits the bill. So, it's interesting to hear the affordances others find in braid, but I'm happy with a range of mono's. I've had a spool of Berkley Fireline 4lb here for about 20 years which I look at and wonder now and then, but can't think what to do with it. Any ideas?

 

[mikench]

I use it as a strong sewing thread for broken seams on salopettes and jackets. It’s excellent for that .

 

[Steve Arnold]

It's clear lots of anglers find braid meets their needs better than mono. But I'm not one of them, and though I've tried braid for fishing a few times - feeder fishing for bream at 50/60 yards, spinning for pike and perch, trotting a float - I don't have any spools with braid on just now. I wouldn't rule out using it should it prove to be the answer to some situation, but none such has arisen yet.

For the various types of fishing I do: it's useless for pole fishing, so that takes care of that; I'm under a lure fishing curse that means casting one out is tantamount to waving it goodbye, but when lures snagged I was surprised to find how easily strong braid broke with "shock" pulls; with feeder fishing, which I've done lots of but steer away from these days, I never felt I was failing to detect bites and find a degree of stretch (when you know your mono lines you can select this) helpful in avoiding breaking off on the strike or in playing fish, big or small; with float fishing, unless you were wading/trotting straight down from the rod tip, the braid's tendency to waft about, lift off the water and do its own thing made it a poor second for fishing out and across. I disliked the way the rod "banged" when playing fish, and, with the braids I tried at least, it was impossible to put shot on them, make float rubbers or indeed anything else grip on them. Always needing to tie on mono leaders or step down leaders and hooklengths was a faff when you wanted to quickly re-rig, or really just wanted to tie a hook on the end of the line, as sometimes fits the bill. So, it's interesting to hear the affordances others find in braid, but I'm happy with a range of mono's. I've had a spool of Berkley Fireline 4lb here for about 20 years which I look at and wonder now and then, but can't think what to do with it. Any ideas?

I did not like Fireline in the sea fishing strengths, the 4lb must be a nightmare to use!
Do not believe any braids quoted breaking strain until you have tested it with a selection of knots first.

Superbraid from the same manufacturer can have different BS quoted for any single diameter, depending on if the label is for the US, EU or Asian markets.......Go Figure!!!!!!

I generally pick a braid line for its diameter now, not what its BS (bullshit!) BS is quoted at.

My last bulk spool of a Daiwa braid quoted a diameter of .21 and a BS of 39lbs. The actual diameter is .19 and the knotted BS averages about 22lb, so that casts very well and rarely breaks when I am snagged. I always have an abrasion resistant leader that I know will break at the knot at a lesser pull than the mainline parts at. Sometimes that is another braid, occasionally mono, I am still experimenting with different leader materials. Some of my leaders have proven very abrasion resistant but knotting it to the braid mainline is weak, again it is the braid and knots problem!

All the advice I have seen online indicates a double uni-knot with extra turns is the best way to join two lengths of braid. Well, I might use it but am under no illusion about its strength, that is still the weakest point of my setup (apart from the hooklength knot). When I make up my tackle at home I always add a tiny blob of superglue to braid knots.

Before anyone says "you do not need glue if you tie a good knot" I will simply say that is not what my decades of using this stuff has proven to me!

Although I do understand how many anglers have learnt to dislike braid I found it worked for me. So many fish caught over decades that I would have struggled to get near, let alone land. It has sometimes been a technical nightmare, largely because you cannot trust many of the advertised claims made for braid lines. But once I learnt to disregard the blurb and trusted to my instincts and testing, superbraid has transformed my fishing.

For the lighter styles of fishing I would still think hard before deciding on using braid. I guess the main negative would be "wind-knots" caused when the line is not kept tight and controlled. I did use braid for float fishing last week, it worked well on the day but there was no wind. If I was back in Scotland fishing for grayling I think I would stick to mono!

Some braids are simply not "nice" - I have wasted some money on these!

The biggest problem with braid is not the material but the manufacturers BS advertising claims

 

[@Clive]

I saw the benefits of braid back in the 1990's for boat fishing off the North Yorkshire coast and on trips to Ireland. Being able to use a 12lb rod and 6oz leads instead of the 30 - 50 lb solid 'glass pokers and 16 - 20 oz leads was a game changer in many ways including bite detection. However, when I've used it for feeder fishing it is a mixed experience. I have always had a mono shock leader after experiencing crack offs during casting braid only rigs. This causes problems in that the double uni knot doesn't always pass cleanly through the tiny guides of quiver tips. Also, the knot acts as a magnet for drifting weed that jams in those guides to the extent that a few weeks ago I had to handline the feeder in. I rarely fish more than a few rod lengths out on rivers and sometimes the braid isn't in the water. The rivers that I fish unlke Steve's venues have near bank access to the outside of bends.

I did not realise that you can safely cast heavy feeders safely using braid. In the past I've had leads depart my carp rods on casting and expected feeders to do the same. A lot of my feeder fishing is for barbel and they hook themselves. No need for the low stretch braid to aid striking. And for the distances that I usually fish, the depth of water and the high banks usually result in very little if any braid being in the water. So for me, the use of braid has been restricted.

 

[Steve Arnold]

I saw the benefits of braid back in the 1990's for boat fishing off the North Yorkshire coast and on trips to Ireland. Being able to use a 12lb rod and 6oz leads instead of the 30 - 50 lb solid 'glass pokers and 16 - 20 oz leads was a game changer in many ways including bite detection. However, when I've used it for feeder fishing it is a mixed experience. I have always had a mono shock leader after experiencing crack offs during casting braid only rigs. This causes problems in that the double uni knot doesn't always pass cleanly through the tiny guides of quiver tips. Also, the knot acts as a magnet for drifting weed that jams in those guides to the extent that a few weeks ago I had to handline the feeder in. I rarely fish more than a few rod lengths out on rivers and sometimes the braid isn't in the water. The rivers that I fish unlke Steve's venues have near bank access to the outside of bends.

I did not realise that you can safely cast heavy feeders safely using braid. In the past I've had leads depart my carp rods on casting and expected feeders to do the same. A lot of my feeder fishing is for barbel and they hook themselves. No need for the low stretch braid to aid striking. And for the distances that I usually fish, the depth of water and the high banks usually result in very little if any braid being in the water. So for me, the use of braid has been restricted.

Hi Clive, that porbeagle I caught on braid jumped clean out of the water. The rod went from loaded to slack and then fully doubled over again as the shark went straight to the bottom in 180' of Pentland Firth tide race. None of the other crew had seen a porgie jump before that, the cry went out "MAKO!" - well, the light was fading!

Up until then braid had been accepted as being poor for shock loading. The fact I was still attached to that shark after its jump had a few anglers questioning their (false!) beliefs. That same spool of braid went on to be used for catching several common skate over the next couple of years, biggest over 200lbs.

Gradually the line was frayed and shortened and I used what was left on an ABU 8000 for shore fishing the Scottish east coast. Plenty of cod caught from the rocks and 55lb Dynon braid was strong enough to cast 6 ounces and a big bait into the rough ground.

I think too many anglers trying braid bought by the quoted breaking strain, many anglers probably had not worked out the best knots either!

Quiver tip rods with braid straight through do have problems with the tip, any slack line allows the spring in the tip to throw loops of limp braid around it. Those tiny eyes really are not suitable for leader knots either, the knots can go through but any imperfections can lead to a crack-off.

Perhaps feeder rods should have bigger eyes? The 4oz tip on my Preston Feeda Feeder rod has slightly bigger eyes than the lighter tips and leader knots fly through easily.

So far I have had no problems with braid around .2mm diameter for casting weights to 3ozs about 80yds. Much bigger feeder weights are cast with the same line, but obviously shorter distance as the rods will not power cast 6 ounces or so.

I have great faith in a decent quality braid!

 

[Alan Whitty]

I have many issues with braid, one being that if I snag with braid and have to pull for a break I'm leaving stronger line creating even worse snags in the river, on powerful flows like you can experience on the Lot the finer diameters equates to holding bottom easier with possibly lighter leads, sadly I don't believe many barbel bites are missed on mono, however other species are, particularly smaller, less aggressive species, if barbel bites are being missed rigs are not set up correctly imo, having knots to give mono/fluorocarbon lengths above leads is also a knot too many for me, I will continue to use old fashioned mono and struggle on....that said ever bit of our tackle is down to personal preferences, what works for you is the best advice I could ever offer anyone...

 

[@Clive]

Whenever I have had to pull for a break on a snag or a zoo creature has broken the line when using braid invariably it is the double uni knot that gives before the weaker hook link. As Steve mentioned, this is a weak link despite my doing 12 turns of the braid and 8 of the mono. I haven't had any problems with losing fish through break offs of the hook links caused by shocks when fishing braid, but I have lost a lot of fish with braid line and barbless hooks even with a long shock leader. And, to be fair I use lower breaking strain hook links than many do for barbel.

For me braid is something to use as and when it would help, but not for most of my fishing. As I use float rods and quiver tip rods with tiny guides I don't trust the knot rattling through the guides when casting and I'm not happy doing anything except gentle lobs without a mono shock leader.

Even my Shimano Purist Barbel 1.75lb has tiny guides, as does the Suveran midweight feeder rod.

 

[Steve Arnold]

I have many issues with braid, one being that if I snag with braid and have to pull for a break I'm leaving stronger line creating even worse snags in the river, on powerful flows like you can experience on the Lot the finer diameters equates to holding bottom easier with possibly lighter leads, sadly I don't believe many barbel bites are missed on mono, however other species are, particularly smaller, less aggressive species, if barbel bites are being missed rigs are not set up correctly imo, having knots to give mono/fluorocarbon lengths above leads is also a knot too many for me, I will continue to use old fashioned mono and struggle on....that said ever bit of our tackle is down to personal preferences, what works for you is the best advice I could ever offer anyone...

Your advice is good - whatever works for you. We all try to fish in a way to avoid leaving our tackle in the river, even if it is only for our bank balances!

The braid mainline I choose is massively over strength, the weak links are close to, or at, the hook. I hate the thought of lengths of line and end gear being left attached to a lost fish so all my rigs are designed with that in mind.

I can use strong braid mainline to help with distance casting as it is thinner than the lower breaking strain, but thicker, mono or coated braids I use for leaders and hook lengths. In really rough swims I have even tested a thin plastic cable tie to attach the weight. I have cut a tiny groove in the cable tie with a small diamond file and tested a few to make sure they break before my mainline.

A snagged rig only needs the mainline wrapped around around my clothed arm or dowelling and a short pull generally gets most tackle back. It has been a long time since I lost a length of mainline, that was probably sea fishing where the reefs were particularly ragged.

My spools of braid do last me an awfully long time, PE braid is UV resistant as well. All this makes these expensive braid lines somewhere near cost-effective!

UV? That brought back a memory. One of the first superbraid lines available was actually made from Kevlar fibres. I bought a few hundred metres for common skate fishing, loaded it on a Shimano TLD25 and went fishing a few times (no skate!) and then put it away for the winter.

The following summer I was back fishing the Sound of Mull in about 300ft depths and dropped my 2lb lead and mackerel bait over the side. After a few seconds my line fell slack and I wound in the find my end rig was missing! I pulled the line between my hands and it was turning to dust - it just fell apart!

Later I found out Kevlar really does not like UV light. Even those "bullet proof" Kevlar vests need to be covered by thick polyester cloth to protect the Kevlar.

I recently bought some Nash Skinlink coated braid for hook lengths, I believe this is Kevlar. The coating looks dense but I will not risk leaving this material in the sun and will test them frequently - just in case. The Skinlink does make up nicely for my purposes so hopefully it will stay protected by its coating.

 

[@Clive]

When I went to be fitted for one of the early Kevlar protective vests the Force Tailor asked if I wanted a knife proof one or a bullet proof one

In those days it wasn't a dual purpose vest and whilst firearms officers got bullet proof we dog handlers could choose. The beat bobbies had to wait years for theirs. Anyway, after a moment's hesitation I asked if it were possible to have it bullet proof at the front for if I was facing an armed robber, and knife proof at the back for when I was facing a senior officer

In the end I got a knife proof one as it was lighter and smaller and took less room in my holdall. I only wore it twice.

 

[nottskev]

What's been posted by those who find uses for braid makes perfect sense - in the context of their fishing. As Clive said "For me braid is something to use as and when it would help, but not for most of my fishing". To which I'd add, I haven't personally found when it would help, which is not the same as having a dislike for it, never trying it or being conservative about lines.

Here's one reason for preferring mono. The lack of stretch in braid is something some find a big advantage, but in my fishing stretch is usually a desirable property of lines, not a shortcoming. The stretch - and different lines can be chosen for their degree of stretch - works alongside the action of rods to provide the necessary shock absorption that allows you to fish with the lightest gear feasible, for best presentation, strike bites and play fish. Also, it helps if your main line is closely matched to your hooklength, as you then benefit from the stretch in both coming into play, helping you avoid hook pulls and crack off's with light lines and small hooks. So you might have a 3 or 4lb main line matched to a 2 or 3lb hooklength. A zero or even low stretch main line with a short skinny stretchy bit on the end just does not work the same. Unless I'm fishing the pole, in which case the elastic does the work, I want lines that have a degree of stretch, especially at the lightest end of the spectrum. Even when I'm snag fishing for barbel at close range, I want the stretch of heavy mono of 12 or 15lb rather than rely just on the rod and a braid that might not react well to sudden shocks on a short length.

I'm not disagreeing with those whose fishing suits braid, just explaining why not using it can be equally reasonable. I should also say my approach to all this dates from BC (that's Before Carp), prior to the beefing up of gear in the new conditions of commercial fisheries.

 

[Keith M]

I have many issues with braid, one being that if I snag with braid and have to pull for a break I'm leaving stronger line creating even worse snags in the river, on powerful flows like you can experience on the Lot the finer diameters equates to holding bottom easier with possibly lighter leads, sadly I don't believe many barbel bites are missed on mono, however other species are, particularly smaller, less aggressive species, if barbel bites are being missed rigs are not set up correctly imo, having knots to give mono/fluorocarbon lengths above leads is also a knot too many for me, I will continue to use old fashioned mono and struggle on....that said ever bit of our tackle is down to personal preferences, what works for you is the best advice I could ever offer anyone...

Im in agreement with Alan and NottsKev.

Except for the occasional hooklengths and when Lure fishing I’ve never really needed to consider using Braid.

Braid mainline is not allowed on most of the rivers, streams and still-waters that I normally fish anyway; but even if it was allowed then I wouldn’t be likely to be using it.

However; I do use a braid mainline when I’m sea and beach fishing with much heavier leads to combat the tidal currents etc. and larger hooks but if Im after smallish fish like Sea Bass and other similar sized fish in places where the tidal flow is fairly negligible then I‘m much happier using nylon together with much lighter weights; and much lighter and a bit more forgiving rods.

When I was younger I did toy with the idea of using braid as a mainline when I’m coarse fishing but after many wind knots and tangles and hook pulls etc. I gave it up as a bad idea.

Keith

 

[Badgerale]

I love braid for lures. I also love that I can pull it out of all but the worst snags.

But i worry it would cut into the mouth of a tench or carp. I don't really know that but it seems like the thinner, less stretchy, material would cause greater mouth damage.