Benyon Rejects Canoeists’ ‘Right to Paddle’ Campaign

[geoffmaynard]

This is where codes of conduct need to be imposed on businesses and licences revoked for repeated bad conduct.

What licenses? They have none I'm aware of. "We can do what we like where we like" seems to be the paddlers mantra, from the hire companies down to the end user.

 

[Berty]

The Wye is now a joke as a fishery at certain times of year, the canoes have in effect ruined a 1000yrs of angling!

It is now at the point where it needs control!

TBO, has a very valid point, an angling body should NOT be paying homage to something that stops us angling.

If anglers want to take to "boats" fine, so long as they stay with the rules.

 

[Terry wright]

Geoff,

The responsible paddler is a member of the BCU and as such pays £37 per annum which gives him a navigation permit and £10,000,000 3rd party liability insurance.

If they are a kayak angler like me then they either have BCU or Angling Trust (Kayak Angler) membership, plus EA licence, day/season ticket.

It is another myth that they pay nothing, most, not all do. A bit like the EA licence and anglers......

 

[Berty]

Geoff,

The responsible paddler is a member of the BCU and as such pays £37 per annum which gives him a navigation permit and £10,000,000 3rd party liability insurance.

If they are a kayak angler like me then they either have BCU or Angling Trust (Kayak Angler) membership, plus EA licence, day/season ticket.

It is another myth that they pay nothing, most, not all do. A bit like the EA licence and anglers......

How can the BCU charge for navigation permit?? when if i want to launch a boat on the Severn they have sweet FA to do with it?

 

[Terry wright]

The BCU act as agents for The Canals and Rivers Trust, The Environment Agency, The Broads Authority and some other navigation authorities. As such part of the membership fee is paid onwards to these authorities for permission to navigate their waters.

 

[waterways]

My take on this is that vast majority of anglers and canoeists are reasonable folk who can share the river without any problems, just as happens in Scotland and in every other country in the world. There is a tiny minority of both who want make trouble.

Martin Salter is the Anglers worst enemy because he keeps trying to stir up trouble, usually by misrepresenting the facts and making Anglers look foolish.

If Fish Legal thought they had a legal leg to stand on, they would have sued someone by now.

The canoeists are not going away. The ones I come across are perfectly reasonable. They stop, ask which way you want them to go, and they are gone in a few seconds.

I'd rather see kids out canoeing or fishing, then hanging around somewhere causing trouble.

Lets all enjoy our beautiful English rivers, not fight over nothing.

 

[Berty]

My take on this is that vast majority of anglers and canoeists are reasonable folk who can share the river without any problems, just as happens in Scotland and in every other country in the world. There is a tiny minority of both who want make trouble.

Martin Salter is the Anglers worst enemy because he keeps trying to stir up trouble, usually by misrepresenting the facts and making Anglers look foolish.

If Fish Legal thought they had a legal leg to stand on, they would have sued someone by now.

The canoeists are not going away. The ones I come across are perfectly reasonable. They stop, ask which way you want them to go, and they are gone in a few seconds.

I'd rather see kids out canoeing or fishing, then hanging around somewhere causing trouble.

Lets all enjoy our beautiful English rivers, not fight over nothing.

Lets see those afloat paying their way.

---------- Post added at 20:19 ---------- Previous post was at 20:18 ----------

The BCU act as agents for The Canals and Rivers Trust, The Environment Agency, The Broads Authority and some other navigation authorities. As such part of the membership fee is paid onwards to these authorities for permission to navigate their waters.

So if i join the BCU can i launch my boat on the Severn?

 

[Terry wright]

If you join the BCU you can launch your kayak or canoe on the river Severn, You can paddle mile upon mile along it but God forbid you if you want to fish from the kayak. Miles of empty bank as many have left to fish carp puddles.


Berty, as said on previous post members of the BCU pay £37 for their membership which includes navigation and £10,000,000 insurance.

---------- Post added at 20:33 ---------- Previous post was at 20:29 ----------

What licenses? They have none I'm aware of. "We can do what we like where we like" seems to be the paddlers mantra, from the hire companies down to the end user.

Geoff,

The business hiring the kayaks wuill have a group navigation permit and they will no doubt have to comply with a number of local authority regulations. They have a duty to act responsibly.

 

[Berty]

If you join the BCU you can launch your kayak or canoe on the river Severn, You can paddle mile upon mile along it but God forbid you if you want to fish from the kayak. Miles of empty bank as many have left to fish carp puddles.


Berty, as said on previous post members of the BCU pay £37 for their membership which includes navigation and £10,000,000 insurance.

---------- Post added at 20:33 ---------- Previous post was at 20:29 ----------



Geoff,

The business hiring the kayaks wuill have a group navigation permit and they will no doubt have to comply with a number of local authority regulations. They have a duty to act responsibly.

What a load of *******s Terry.........i can not just lauch my boat on the Severn!!....you were quick enough in jumping on Geoff for answers but you are far better at spouting a load of *****.........

 

[Terry wright]

Sorry Berty but you are being a little discourteous here.

Read my post!

I clearly and deliberately said ' kayak or canoe'. I did not mention boat.

Your apology will be gratefully received.

 

[Berty]

Sorry Berty but you are being a little discourteous here.

Read my post!

I clearly and deliberately said ' kayak or canoe'. I did not mention boat.

Your apology will be gratefully received.

You will wait a long time!.......... You side stepped !!now tell me why a Kayak or canoe should have such preferencial treatment over us humble boat people.

 

[Terry wright]

Oh My God !!! You saw what you wanted to see and were not prepared to accept you made a mistake. You have just lost all credibility hopefully in the eyes of more than just myself.

A BCU member has the right to paddle his canoe or kayak along the river. He has no right to fish.

Now it is your chance, you can have the same access as BCU members. Surely you do not expect it for free do you?
Go to the Canals and Rivers Trust and pay for a navigation licence.
http://canalrivertrust.org.uk/media/library/1192.pdf
But that will not give you any fishing rights.

Rivers Only £280.43 for boats under 18ft, but then if you have a boat you will already have that licence I am sure.

 

[Berty]

Oh My God !!! You saw what you wanted to see and were not prepared to accept you made a mistake. You have just lost all credibility hopefully in the eyes of more than just myself.

A BCU member has the right to paddle his canoe or kayak along the river. He has no right to fish.

Now it is your chance, you can have the same access as BCU members. Surely you do not expect it for free do you?
Go to the Canals and Rivers Trust and pay for a navigation licence.
http://www.nativewatercraft.com/boat_detail.cfm?id=48
But that will not give you any fishing rights.

Rivers Only £280.43 for boats under 18ft, but then if you have a boat you will already have that licence I am sure.

Thanks, for the compliment, but dispite my missus saying the same thing the other night i have to say i ain't a god........ I never mentioned fishing from my boat!!.......and no, i dont want it for free!! i want the same rights as a canoeist or kayaker but in my boat!!



I saw what you said...and i don't give a **** about my cred, but tell me why you can get for £37 what someone else pays £280 for? and then scream about rights to go anywhere you feel like!!!!????

 

[Terry wright]

So you think a cyclist should pay a VEL comparable with a motorcycle?
Conversely why should you pay less than the £609.79 that a 71ft boat has to pay?

There are one or two things that differentiate a kayak from a motor propelled boat, the speed you travel generates a wash and the erosion of the bank is accellerated by wash from boats. Repair of damage and work to prevent further erosion costs money.
Many boats need to use lock when travelling any distance on a river. The construction and maitenance of these locks is very costly. So again those who use lock should bear some of the costs.

I do volountary work with the Canals and Rivers Trust and I know the massive costs this charity has doing maintenance. The price of a licence is probaly well short of what is needed to do everything they would love to do.

Join an organisation they may be able to purchase a bulk concession and get a discount.

 

[Berty]

So you think a cyclist should pay a VEL comparable with a motorcycle?
Conversely why should you pay less than the £609.79 that a 71ft boat has to pay?

There are one or two things that differentiate a kayak from a motor propelled boat, the speed you travel generates a wash and the erosion of the bank is accellerated by wash from boats. Repair of damage and work to prevent further erosion costs money.
Many boats need to use lock when travelling any distance on a river. The construction and maitenance of these locks is very costly. So again those who use lock should bear some of the costs.

I do volountary work with the Canals and Rivers Trust and I know the massive costs this charity has doing maintenance. The price of a licence is probaly well short of what is needed to do everything they would love to do.

Join an organisation they may be able to purchase a bulk concession and get a discount.

But it's OK for kayakers to ruin a 1000+yr angling heritage and trespass...yes i know that bit is under debate, but what if i paddle through that small upper river in my boat....will you argue my cause?

I'm not really interested in what you do volountary, i'm interested in fairness for all.

 

[Terry wright]

Berty perhaps you should leave the art of reasoned discussion to those more able.

Each time you are proved wrong you just ignore the point and attack something else. You have so many chips on your shoulder you should go sea fishing and get a portion of cod.

You do your cause no justice when others can do it so much better. I am an angler and a paddler. At no time have I advocated unfettered access, indeed I wrote ' reasonable access where appropriate.'
You say 'fairness to all'! You do not mean it. You mean fairness to anglers.

'1000+years of angling heritage'
Strange that is around the time of the Magna Carta which was the first time public Rights of Navigation were created by government via that same document.
It could be said that angling is disrupting over 1000 years of navigation heritage.
'Fairness to all'.

 

[Paul Boote]

It Is Happening Again - YouTube

 

[Terry wright]

Fishing Magic must be truely proud.

I am confident at least that a couple of posters do not reflect the majority of reasonable posters on this site.

 

[Paul Boote]

All this endless Paddlers' Ping Pong. Debate coherently, even spell correctly, then clued-up people like myself might give you more than just a sighing "Oh dear" moment of their time.

 

[The bad one]

If you join the BCU you can launch your kayak or canoe on the river Severn, You can paddle mile upon mile along it but God forbid you if you want to fish from the kayak. Miles of empty bank as many have left to fish carp puddles..

This reads like not only are you bitching about being able to paddle on the Severn, which you can as far up as Welshpool but no further, but you want the right to fish where you like when you like from your kayak for the price of an EA licence and because there are few or no anglers present.
Nowt like bleedin cheek is there!

THE FISHING RIGHTS ARE OWNED BY SOMEONE!

You have no rights to fish there unless the owner gives you permission to do so. To do so without that permission will mean you are committing the act of Poaching. And no amount of digging about in Magna Carta for long defunct rights will get you out of that one!

It is because of people like you that I will not rejoin the Angling Trust and their pandering to you and your ilk! I also know that there are many, many other river anglers that feel the same way. I talk to them on a weekly basis when checking their club cards.

You've stated above if the AT thought they had a case against paddlers they'd have gone to court over it. Now call me cynical but given they are offering both kayakers and canoeists insurance cover no doubt deriving a management/handling fee from that, they are unlikely to. Which raises a larger question on this issue, "In who's best interests are they really acting on?" The vast majority of anglers who fund them? Their own and an income stream derived? The paddlers and their own?