Canal lb line

[markcw]

Try making a hooklength with the same mainline and attatch loop to loop.
Even though hooklength and mainline are same bs, In theory it should snap at the knot, this supposedly being the weaker part.

 

[108831]

I use a hooklink to gain an advantage in presentation,with the benefit of breaking below the mainlines b.s.,most hooklengths these days are six inches long,as I tie my own I rarely use one so short,I use the lines I do because I have confidence in them,if I didn't I would be searching for lines I liked,the thought of being concerned about my mainline so much I had to use 6lb to a 2lb hooklink would be galling...

 

[wetthrough]

Using fairly soft actioned rods probably compensates for the lack of mainline stretch to some degree.

 

[RMNDIL]

I use that Fluorocarbon a LOT. There is NO way 4.4lb Float Fish should break consistently and EVERY time before 3.3lb SF unless it has been damaged, compressed, is old, is worn, etc etc. The SF is calibrated using 5 turn Grinner knots and overhand loops with multiple tests to get an average. Same with any line (unless you are as silly as the industry/EFTTA - but that's another debate). And you will always get some odd or strange results and have to discount wild ones to get a more 'reasonable' average. It can almost drive you to the funny farm once you have conducted a lot. But SF 3.3lb is pretty much spot on for average KNOTTED BS. NOT linear.

You cannot fault the FF as those results are pretty good. Unfortunately labelling any line with it's actual (as near as damn it) knot BS is a problem (ask Berkley) because people are so used to the BS being quoted at lower than it actually is. Lines get reputations for being strong for their diameter mostly because......they are !!!! It's amazing even now how labelling with Red Herrings can cause people to think that.

But that doesn't explain a higher diameter, higher BS FF breaking EVERY time before a low diameter lower BS FC. Post the FF and FC samples to Ian Brooker. He'll check both with Dave Ellyatt.

 

[wetthrough]

I didn't say it broke every time. Once was enough and yes, the line could well have been damaged, I've no way of knowing but as it breaks away from the knot when it's brand new it isn't really off to a very good start IMO.

 

[RMNDIL]

It broke once...in use... before the lower BS hooklength. Is that all ?? That could be due to any number of things.

That in bench tests it breaks in the line and not at a knot BUT at the correct, higher or reasonably close to labelled B/S is not a problem, So it's a 'Ronseal' job. And your knots are pretty darn good !!!

Test the SF on your bench and see what you get. Bet it's not consistently above 4lb !!! Nowhere near it.

I bet my house on it not being stupidly sub-standard Float Fish or ridiculously strong FC.

All sorts of 'strange' things happen when we fish and very often we cannot explain them. More, often its not worth trying to find out why.

 

[108831]

Strange,I really am not a fan of supplex fluorocarbon(or supplex line)or an other fluoro for floatfishing,I don't believe in it's invisibilty in water,as i've said many times,it is what you prefer. As for mainlines,many very capable anglers like floatfish and use it without complaint,we really are a fickle bunch. Last year I bought some pro-gold in 3.4 & 4.4lb,it fishes ok,until you have caught some big fish on it,or a bag,then it suffers terribly with line twist,Sensor seems good,,horses for courses I suppose...

 

[wetthrough]

I'm by no means convinced of the invisibility claims Alan. Maybe when it's brand new it can be demonstrated but by the time it has grease off your fingers and picked up crud from the surface it's doubtful IMO. The break wasn't the only reason I went off FF. It has a marked tendency to curl when sliding shot.

 

[wetthrough]

@RMNDIL DIL

"That in bench tests it breaks in the line and not at a knot BUT at the correct, higher or reasonably close to labelled B/S is not a problem, So it's a 'Ronseal' job. And your knots are pretty darn good !!!

I just have the viewpoint that the knot should be the weak point. If it isn't when it's brand new it's only going to get worse with wear and tear.

I no longer have the spool of Supplex FC I was using at the time otherwise I would test it.

 

[RMNDIL]

All lines get 'worse' with wear & tear and age etc. If you carry out enough tests - as in 100's - you'll find that some lines, for whatever reason, do often break in the line. Even different diameters of the same make-up of line. It doesn't make one any better/worse than the other so long as they are breaking reasonably consistently and close to whatever you want them to be. It does prove your knots are very good though.

And different people can get consistently different results with the same line, same knots and same tests !!! It's weird. Ask Dave Ellyatt.

If I had a labelled 3.2lb line which broke in the line consistently at 3.54lb - 3.72lb I would be VERY happy. Even if it lost 10% of it's BS after some time it's still above 3.2lb. But what if it were labelled 3.8lb ? Same line different opinion ? What if it were labelled 2.6lb - now it would 'seem' really 'strong' !!! I think it was Berkeley many years ago who re-labelled one of their lines with a BS which was more accurate and then they ended up with lots & lots of complaints because people bought by BS and swore the 'new' stuff was not as strong as the 'old ' stuff. Which, of course, if you bought by B/S it wouldn't be. I think they reverted back to original labelling sometime after.

But it's all Horses for Courses and whatever anyone has confidence in. Same with most things.

 

[108831]

I believe that you and a I can tie say a grinner knot 'identically',but in reality we all do things slightly differently,i'm thinking of trying to film myself tying my loop knot(a mammoth task for a technophobe),purely because i'm convinced it is a brilliant and easy knot to tie,failure rate for me is virtually nil,but I believe that the care you take in tying,clinching and lubricating,along with being slow in ensuring these things creates better quality knots,but and it's a big but,each line has a best knot to use for it too,so experimentation is wise,that is if your that fussed,some aren't...

 

[RMNDIL]

I don't even wet my knots 99% of the time (shock, horror). Never have whether for my own use or in test. I have experimented with dry knot v wet knot a few times and, if anything, the wet knot was slightly 'weaker'. But nothing to really worry about at all. I wet a knot if it's complicated, with lots of turns in fine line (so generally like 0.06mm, 0.07mm). I'm convinced a dry knot 'grips' or 'beds' better. But then we throw it in water anyway !

 

[108831]

Just to say I tried filming my loop knot a few moments ago,it does not stay in focus well,so a failure on my behalf(and the wife).

 

[RMNDIL]

What is your loop knot formulation ? Or is it a pain to try and describe ?

What is wrong with a Double Overhand loop or Figure of 8 ? I've used Double Overhand loops in mainlines and hooklengths for decades and I cannot think of one ever breaking (may have done, but cannot remember it ever having happened so can't be anything wrong with them anyway) which I would say was a problem or a worry. Certainly never in the mainline. On a fish snatched by a pike ? Likely.

Or my memory is rubbish !

 

[108831]

On number 1 you start to form a loop,in 2 you hold said loop across your forefinger,holding the line in place with your thumb,taking the loose ends over your finger and making another loop,which you push through in 3,in four you have eased the knot down and putting a baiting needle(or crochet hook in my case) and pull tight after wetting,the photo shows the finished knot,this process takes me seconds....

 

[108831]

I apologise for my pi$$ poor explanation,it is so simple,quick and efficient it's untrue,but like all knots that comes with practice.

 

[108831]

What is your loop knot formulation ? Or is it a pain to try and describe ?

What is wrong with a Double Overhand loop or Figure of 8 ? I've used Double Overhand loops in mainlines and hooklengths for decades and I cannot think of one ever breaking (may have done, but cannot remember it ever having happened so can't be anything wrong with them anyway) which I would say was a problem or a worry. Certainly never in the mainline. On a fish snatched by a pike ? Likely.

Or my memory is rubbish !

My loop may be the knot you speak of,but I dont think so,I believe it is a single overhand loop,but if you were in front of me you would pick up the general idea quickly,then practice reduces the size of loops.

 

[RMNDIL]

That's a Single Overhand loop. If you pass the line back through a 2nd time to avoid any chance of slipping it's a Double Overhand loop.

If you insert a needle into the formation of the 'knot' before you tighten you can slide the knot down easily to any size you want then just pull the needle out

 

[108831]

I thought it was,well I use it for barbel on heavy gear and hold big fish hard when necessary,it never ever shifts,I believe because I tighten it correctly... Or what I deem as correctly...

 

[108831]

Just to add,I didn't like the double overhand loop,as the knot is bulkier.