Horses for courses

tiinker

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It seems to me that the vast majority of record claims these days are from opportunistic catches not by design. My personal feeling is that this takes something away from the achievement as it is unplanned and just luck of the draw. What are your feelings on the matter.
 

Peter Jacobs

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It seems to me that the vast majority of record claims these days are from opportunistic catches not by design. My personal feeling is that this takes something away from the achievement as it is unplanned and just luck of the draw. What are your feelings on the matter.
To my mind it is the fish that holds the record and not the angler who happens to catch it . . . . .

That said, the captor of, say, a 4lb true Roach that took a hair rigged 16mm boilie fished at over 100 yards from the bank can hardly claim that his Roach was caught by design . . . . can he?
 

sam vimes

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That's fishing. Provided the record is caught legally and with a rod and line, I couldn't care less if it were a fluke or a bye-catch. It should be about the fish, not the angler. If it's the biggest of its kind caught on rod and line, that should be the end of it. The record fish itself matters, who caught it, and by what method, on what tackle, shouldn't really matter a toss.

It's a different kettle of fish for an individual angler though. Despite the above attitude towards records, I'd rather not catch a PB tench or bream when out with carp gear. However, I'd rather catch it on carp gear than not catch it at all.
 

tiinker

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That's fishing. Provided the record is caught legally and with a rod and line, I couldn't care less if it were a fluke or a bye-catch. It should be about the fish, not the angler. If it's the biggest of its kind caught on rod and line, that should be the end of it. The record fish itself matters, who caught it, and by what method, on what tackle, shouldn't really matter a toss.

It's a different kettle of fish for an individual angler though. Despite the above attitude towards records, I'd rather not catch a PB tench or bream when out with carp gear. However, I'd rather catch it on carp gear than not catch it at all.
It matters to me if what you say in the first was true then the angler that captured the fish should remain anonymous. but that is not the case is it. It seems today how you catch the fish comes very low down in the order of things. I am never more disappointed when I catch a tench or roach on carp tackle and visa versa when I catch a larger than expected fish on lighter tackle than I would normally use for that size of fish as long as I do not have to over play a fish.
 

sam vimes

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It matters to me if what you say in the first was true then the angler that captured the fish should remain anonymous. but that is not the case is it.
The vast majority of record holders are anonymous unknowns. I haven't got a clue who they are and couldn't care less who they are. It's people and the angling industry that attach such importance to the captors. Catching a record fish is no indicator of anything, why should anyone care who managed it?

It seems today how you catch the fish comes very low down in the order of things. I am never more disappointed when I catch a tench or roach on carp tackle and visa versa when I catch a larger than expected fish on lighter tackle than I would normally use for that size of fish as long as I do not have to over play a fish.
What would you propose to do about it? Written and witnessed statements, made before an angler sets off, as to what species they are targeting that day? No fish other than those specifically targeted to count? Fish caught on overly heavy gear don't count, but those accidentally caught on more proportionate kit do?

It's simply not realistic to discount records based on intent or kit used. Make it all about the fish, all this nonesense goes away. Anonymize it if necessary, in reality, it's of no consequence who catches a record fish.
 

richiekelly

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All of my biggest Chub have been caught while I have been fishing for Barbel, should I discount them because I wasn't fishing for Chub?

My biggest Zander came while Pike fishing its just the luck of the draw within angling.
 

tiinker

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The vast majority of record holders are anonymous unknowns. I haven't got a clue who they are and couldn't care less who they are. It's people and the angling industry that attach such importance to the captors. Catching a record fish is no indicator of anything, why should anyone care who managed it?



What would you propose to do about it? Written and witnessed statements, made before an angler sets off, as to what species they are targeting that day? No fish other than those specifically targeted to count? Fish caught on overly heavy gear don't count, but those accidentally caught on more proportionate kit do?

It's simply not realistic to discount records based on intent or kit used. Make it all about the fish, all this nonesense goes away. Anonymize it if necessary, in reality, it's of no consequence who catches a record fish.
It can only be down to the individual whether he or she claims or not.
 

sam vimes

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It can only be down to the individual whether he or she claims or not.
True, but that bears no relation to what I've written.:confused:
Besides, you might try questioning Peter, he's said pretty much the same as I have, you like his post yet you take me to task for saying the same thing.:confused:
 

tiinker

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All of my biggest Chub have been caught while I have been fishing for Barbel, should I discount them because I wasn't fishing for Chub?

My biggest Zander came while Pike fishing its just the luck of the draw within angling.
That is a question for you to answer yourself . But do you not get a extra buzz when you catch the fish you have set your table for. I catch carp when I am tench fishing but I do not weigh them no matter how big they are they are not what I am fishing for.
 

dangermouse

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. But do you not get a extra buzz when you catch the fish you have set your table for.
Yes it`s nice when you catch your intended species. However not everyone sets out with a particular target in mind. There are plenty of happy splodgers out there, myself included at times, who just go out to catch a few fish and don`t really care what they are.

Surely part of the joy of fishing is the surprise catch, be it a record or a large fish or just something unexpected?
 

richiekelly

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That is a question for you to answer yourself . But do you not get a extra buzz when you catch the fish you have set your table for. I catch carp when I am tench fishing but I do not weigh them no matter how big they are they are not what I am fishing for.




No, a fish is a fish to me whether I have set out to catch one particular species or not.

It doesn't alter the size or look or the pleasure of catching a fish because I caught it while fishing for something else, my biggest roach was caught on hair rigged peanut while fishing for Carp did it fight, no of coarse not but it was still a magnificent looking fish that I was happy to have caught and be able to admire.
 

tiinker

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It can only be down to the individual whether he or she claims or not.
The difference was you said you would rather catch it than not did you not.

---------- Post added at 11:20 ---------- Previous post was at 10:56 ----------

Yes it`s nice when you catch your intended species. However not everyone sets out with a particular target in mind. There are plenty of happy splodgers out there, myself included at times, who just go out to catch a few fish and don`t really care what they are.

Surely part of the joy of fishing is the surprise catch, be it a record or a large fish or just something unexpected?
I myself was taught at a time when you set your table for a certain specie . I dabbled as a youngster and was glad to catch anything. But by my early teens I was fishing for individual species so were my friends. Mainly roach and perch tench crucians half a crown carp chub and bream pike depending on the time of year. That is the way I still fish.
 

dorsetandchub

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Gents,


Surely, the whole point of angling is that it's a smorgasbord? You decide what you want from it, whether that is to specialise in one or more species, to match fish or, like me, to cast out a bait and be delighted by whatever comes along?

Speaking purely for myself, I think life's too short to want to catch only one species of fish but that's just my take. I respect anybody who takes that path, even though it's not my choice.

To my mind, it doesn't matter if a big or record fish falls to somebody who's given their life to catching it or to a first time angler or to a non-species approach.

It's the element of chance. It's there for all of us. Very possibly, single species specialism or determinism or, simply, putting the hours in might increase that chance a little but, simply, it IS chance.

Angling's big enough for all of us, for ALL approaches and for NEW approaches. It's one great, big experiment and we do all learn every time we partake.

Surely, live and let live - and learn, is the name of the game? :)
 

tiinker

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Gents,


Surely, the whole point of angling is that it's a smorgasbord? You decide what you want from it, whether that is to specialise in one or more species, to match fish or, like me, to cast out a bait and be delighted by whatever comes along?

Speaking purely for myself, I think life's too short to want to catch only one species of fish but that's just my take. I respect anybody who takes that path, even though it's not my choice.

To my mind, it doesn't matter if a big or record fish falls to somebody who's given their life to catching it or to a first time angler or to a non-species approach.

It's the element of chance. It's there for all of us. Very possibly, single species specialism or determinism or, simply, putting the hours in might increase that chance a little but, simply, it IS chance.

Angling's big enough for all of us, for ALL approaches and for NEW approaches. It's one great, big experiment and we do all learn every time we partake.

Surely, live and let live - and learn, is the name of the game? :)
It is up to the individual and the standards he or she sets herself. I am not a single specie angler. I fish for certain species at certain times of the year and I have my own standards. It is no different than having line class records like IGFA. To myself catching certain species of fish on balanced gear for that specie is what angling is about. Catching fish on whatever gear you happen to be using at the time is not the same thing for me.
 

dorsetandchub

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Exactly what I'm saying, Tiink, it's all individual and angling's big enough to be all things to all men (and ladies, of course).


Phil. :)
 

chris k

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Remember as a child you would cast out that float with a maggot, and the excitement of watching the float slip away under the water and wondering what it could be? that mystery and wonder is what got most of us into angling, it didn't matter if it was a Roach or a Perch!! So why should it matter now? Yes you may set out and catch your intended quarry, but don't forget yes there is skill involved, but Lady Luck does play a part.

I also think the fish missed the memo about only taking baits on particular methods. :eek:mg:
Surely this helps towards angling development, you only have to look at the Carp terminal tackle that has made the cross over to general coarse fishing!. and I'm sure those people who are fishing for Carp and catch Tench, and moan about it would soon moan if they blanked.
 

tiinker

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Remember as a child you would cast out that float with a maggot, and the excitement of watching the float slip away under the water and wondering what it could be? that mystery and wonder is what got most of us into angling, it didn't matter if it was a Roach or a Perch!! So why should it matter now? Yes you may set out and catch your intended quarry, but don't forget yes there is skill involved, but Lady Luck does play a part.

I also think the fish missed the memo about only taking baits on particular methods. :eek:mg:
Surely this helps towards angling development, you only have to look at the Carp terminal tackle that has made the cross over to general coarse fishing!. and I'm sure those people who are fishing for Carp and catch Tench, and moan about it would soon moan if they blanked.
I know a few that have caught fish of a lifetime while carp fishing and called them nuisance fish some really do. Back in the early 70s I landed a fish for a friend of mine a carp angler. I weighed the fish it went 9 pound he said bloody Tench . I still knock him about it. That's the way it takes some people. I have nightmares about Bream mucking up my Tench fishing.
 
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