rods and reels for barbel fishing

[ian g]

TBF Clive its often worth cutting a little bit more back as it soon grows back

 

[@Clive]

TBF Clive its often worth cutting a little bit more back as it soon grows back

I'm happy to cut back enough to give room for future sessions Ian, but it is just twigs and light branches. Nothing that could be removed using a saw.

 

[Keith M]

Just to add to the quandry, many of the swims I fish have low tree canopies and so I am restricted to shorter rods. In many cases I opt for a 10 foot rod simply to avoid getting caught up in branches. One day I will pack a step ladder and tree loppers. The plus side is that I can usually find swims that don't require a long cast. And the barbel don't reach the size they do back home. So if I pre-bait using a dropper on a telescopic rod kept purely for that purpose, the short casting distances and smaller quarry mean that I can get away with lighter tackle than most people would consider.

View attachment 27475

Seeing your Split cane rod in your picture bought back fond memories of my very first Barbel; touch legering on the river Kennet way back in 1975 using a 10ft Split cane B.James & Son Richard Walker MKIV Carp rod; together with a Mitchell 300 reel loaded with 8lb Silcast line tied directly to a size 4 Specimen hook; using a 5 SSG link Leger. That was 48 years ago and I still remember it as clearly as if it was yesterday .

I must have caught thousands of Barbel since that memorable (to me) day but regardless I’ll always remember my very first Barbel.



I still have the split cane MKIV rod and Mitchell reel that I caught my very first Barbel with hanging up on the wall in my fishing den.

Clive; what rod were you using in your picture?

Keith

 

[@Clive]

Seeing your Split cane rod in your picture bought back find memories of my very first Barbel; touch legering on the river Kennet way back in 1975 using a 10ft Split cane B.James & Son Richard Walker MKIV Carp rod; together with a Mitchell 300 reel loaded with 8lb Silcast line tied directly to a size 4 Specimen hook. That was 48 years ago and I still remember it as clearly as if it was yesterday .

I must have caught thousands of Barbel since that memorable (to me) day.



I still have the split cane MKIV rod and Mitchell reel that I caught my very first Barbel with hanging up on the wall in my fishing den.

Clive; what rod were you using in your picture?

Keith

Keith,
That rod is a Mk. IV Avon. Back in the day Richard Walker got fed up with planing, curing and building rods so he got some ready made blanks made to his specifications from a company called J.B. Walker (no relation) from Hythe in Kent. He wrote in a letter to another angler that the blanks were built by Bob Southwell from cane planed, cured and supplied by JBW. The blanks and everything that you needed to finish the rods, cork, guides, ferrules, etc. were sent to RW, I think he ordered 10. He finished the rods and gave them to his friends who accompanied him on the trips including when he caught the record carp. There is a suggestion that RW used a different, more powerful rod for the record fish, but he always said that it was the Mk. IV that he used to land the record.

There was a big demand for Mk. IV Carp rods and JBW were not interested in making completed rods so RW came to an agreement with B James to make Mk. IV rods that were endorsed by him. JBW continued to make Mk. IV Carp and Avon kits true to RW's specifications until the mid 70's. Mine is one of those, as is my Mk. IV Carp rod. They are lovely rods to use.

Get it off the wall and go out there and use it as it was meant to be used

 

[Ray Roberts]

I’ve bitten the bullet today and bought a FreeSpirit River tamer 1.5tc. I have a few quiver tip rods and good carp rods but I wanted a rod for barbel. I’m going to the Seven with some mates in September and it may be a little under gunned if the river is in flood but I will use a light carp rod if that’s the case. Meanwhile, I’m going to have another crack at them on my local river Eden and it should prove ideal for that and for the large chub that reside there.


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[Steve Arnold]

Agreed. However for those outer twiggy branches croppers are better. Then you don't hae to remove more than is necessary. What I really need are telescopic loppers.

Last week I purchased a telescopic battery hedge trimmer. On thin stuff it makes very quick work and does the new growth easily, it will save me using the ladder on my 10' hedge too often.

Today I returned from two days at the campsite at Vers. The swim I fancied had a thin branch grown across it and lots of rubbish growing outwards from the embankment. Eventually I got a towrope, used my long handled landing net to lasso the branch and then pulled it around to a tree. Tied the rope off and I was good to fish!

So the next time I go there, probably in a week, I will pack the extendable hedge cutter. Doubt the campsite will mind, maybe they will do it themselves when they see what their customers need to do. No, that will not happen!

 

[Goldfish]

Bit late in the day but my choice is 2lb test curve harrisons, 6000 size shimano baitrunners, 10 or 12lb line. Sums it up really. Id be confident taking this set up to any river in the country. If just small rivers can go down to 4000 but the Thames is big with big fish so would go for 6000 just to be sure. Also the little extra strength that a 2lb tc rod gives you over a 1.75 tc rod is nice and doesn't really effect the fun of the fight. Think the 5000s were the best size for barbel but unfortunately they've been discontinued in baitrunner reels. Baitrunners come in handy whether using 1 rod or 2. Just nice to feed some line out when needed.

 

[Alan Whitty]

Wow, a 6000 reel, a light beachcaster sized sewing machine, lol, fishing on the H.Avon and D.Stour you would be massively outgunned, a good job we are all different.
I still say we have been drawn into fishing for barbel with ever growing test curves where you can land the biggest barbel with less quite quickly, I use 12lb mainline 10lb hooklengths even on 1.6lb t.c and 1.75lb t.c., but it's all about what you are happy with....

 

[Goldfish]

I fish a big river which the Thames is too. The 4000 size reel I'd use for match fishing lol tiny thing. Use it for trundling meat on a chalk stream. And better to be over gunned than under gunned. If you're over gunned you can still do it. If you're under gunned you cant. Like I said the 5000 was perfect but no longer available. I've had the 4000 size before and felt like it was gonna explode on a big river with the work load.

 

[Alan Whitty]

I use 4000's(prefer to) on the H.Avon, D.Stour and Thames and as I said in an earlier post have no problems, but I also dislike using the bait runner facility for them too, I don't let them get going and stop them very quickly on 1.75lb and 1lb 6ozs, if you are fishing the Trent carbelling style you have to have heavier, just wonder what people did before such heavy rods existed....

 

[mikench]

Have you tried a 4000 , 6000 or 10,000 size with the same line. Take these figures.

Shimano ST RB Model Specs:​

Shimano Baitrunner ST 6000 RB​

• Weight:550g
• Ball Bearings: 1 Roller Bearings + 1 Ball Bearing
• Line Capacity: 10lb-300yds
• Gear Ratio: 4.6 : 1

Shimano Baitrunner ST 10000 RB​

• Weight:555g
• Ball Bearings: 1 Roller Bearings + 1 Ball Bearing
• Line Capacity: 10lb-430yds
• Gear Ratio: 4.6 : 1

Apart from a bigger spool and consequent line capacity they are identical . The 4000 is the same except for a gear ratio of 4.8:1 and a smaller spool. The innards are the same in all three. Different specification reels however will be different.

 

[Alan Whitty]

Are you asking me Mike??? If so, it's the use of the facility that doesn't work within my barbel fishing, give them an inch they take a very fast mile,even centrepins create the same effect if you leger with them....I sit on my rods, pounce on bites and get control(of a sort), only on the small river I fish do I let barbel have more rope, however it costs me sometimes, which it doesn't/hasn't for many, many years when I fish other rivers...

 

[nottskev]

Interesting the weights of those reels are so similar. But they're both pretty heavy. Compare those reels with what I use: Shimano Stradic 4000 326g; Okuma Trent 314g. That makes a huge difference if you plan to be actively (if I can put it like that) fishing for them eg floatfishing, rolling or trundling a bait, touch ledgering, searching for them with a bomb or link ledger, or anything else where you're holding the rod. The weights I gave were for loaded reels, too, so those baitrunners will only get heavier with nearly a quarter of a mile of line added!

The Baitrunners are the logical option for certain styles of fishing though, and the weight I suppose doesn't matter if they are on a rest. I definitely up the power of the rod according to the swims, but I' don't go for big reels. I'd say it's retrieving big feeders and leads rather than playing barbel that's the weakness of smaller reels, and I rarely do anything like that.

 

[Goldfish]

Exactly kev. The big reels are just that. Reeling in heavy feeders and leads that are necessary on the bigger rivers especially in floods. I would never use a 6000 size reel on a smaller river. Far too heavy. But it's the job it has to do. Same with heavy rods. It's the conditions not the fish. The biggest barbel in the country could probably be caught in a snag free stillwater using a match rod and 6lb line. Not catch it in a snaggy river full of bolders in a flood using that gear though. The op mentioned the Thames and I know a couple of very successful Thames barbel anglers. They use 6000 reels simply as tools to cast out heavy feeders and leads. The baitrunner facility is useful when paying out some line. It's more controlled that using backwind or opening the balearm and if you change line like you should do line twist shouldn't be an issue. Obviously baitrunners become more important when using 2 rods. Each to their own though and we all fish different rivers so require different tools to catch the fish.

 

[Alan Whitty]

I do understand Mick, as I posted earlier I don't like sea fishing on rivers, so don't, using over 4ozs of lead simply doesn't happen, nor using mahoosive feeders,if you have ever seen the H.Avon, D.Stour, Gt.Ouse or Ivel in summer you are lucky to find a hole in the weed to fish in,leaving you with the situation of having to not allow a fish to run, that's without bankside trees, or snags that in a smaller river are legitimate targets for bertie, I'm not belittling your fishing or tackle for rivers like the Ribble and Trent, especially in particularly snaggy areas, I just wouldn't barbel fish them... having two rods isn't barbel fishing imo and yes I know many do, but having two lines in the water for spooky fish to bump into doesn't work for me, also hooking a second barbel on a baitrunner in supposedly snaggy, boulder filled water is irresponsible at best, if you think about it in hindsight.... each river, nay swim has its own problems to overcome tackle wise, it is funny how we used to have a poster on FM who caught loads of barbel on the float on 6lb line fishing the Ribble, some bigguns too....

 

[Goldfish]

Funny thing Alan is I've got two identical rods for barbel fishing but up to now I've always used one rod. I, like you, have never used two rods. It just doesn't feel right. Double takes, line tangling up, twice as much leads or feeders to take and lose. The cons seem to outweigh the pros and im not convinced I'd catch more using two rods. Maybe one day I'll give two rods a go. Anyway probably something for another post.
Mick.

 

[Alan Whitty]

As I said many do, might be OK if you cast 30 yards apart eh?

 

[nottskev]

Where you sit/stand can make a big difference to what gear you can get them out on. If your river suits wading, and you're comfortable with it, you can solve in one stroke several of the problems that dictate heavier rather than lighter gear: you won't have to work round trees trailing in the water, rocky and snaggy margins and banks to play and net fish over, poor angles to play fish from .... all things that oblige you play fish hard or stop them in their tracks. Being out in the water can give you more open space to play them and puts you where you can pull fish away from bankside snags instead of towards them, as when you can stand in the river and fish down the tree-line. Iirc, the angler who swore by 6lb line - he certainly caught loads of barbel - fished in the water quite a bit and used quality float rods rather than dedicated barbel rods. I don't know if there's any truth in the idea that barbel can sometimes be more easily subdued on float and softer rods? I actually use a 12' 1.75lb Torrix these days for float-fishing - it's ok for open swims and has enough power for more confined ones. I do have a lovely 15' Shimano Specimen Float Rod, thanks to an FM member, but in a lot of conditions, given the average size of the fish these days, it keeps bending when you need power to get the fish up or hold it away from something.

 

[Ray Roberts]

The 6lb line that is referred to breaks at 8.5lb in the brown variety. In clear the breaking strain would be presumably higher. The 6lb clear isn’t listed on the Tackle Box chart but as the breaking strain for the clear version is higher at every breaking strain than listed for the brown version, I would guess that it breaks at around the nine pound mark. This would probably exceed the line rating for most trotting rods, so not really foolhardy of him to use it.


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[Goldfish]

Ray also the tackle box charts are rated using a knotless knot and a grinner knot to resemble what most people would use as hooklength. Bit strange seeing their mainlines. If using a palomar (which tends to be a bit stronger than a grinner with mono, not braid) the strengths you stated could be even stronger. Good stuff that sensor mono.