Why use braid mainline?

[Ray Roberts]

Totally agree with using tackle that you land the fish you are targeting, however that is laughable when b.s. of 40lbs is being thrown around, OTT is what I class it as, using lines as per conditions and requirements is good angling, the crucians that I've caught this year have been caught on 0.10mm hooklengths, why, because the buggers don't bite on heavier and 0.12mm results in half the bites, which when some days you are talking about getting three in a full day that isn't viable, to me at least, this is also going on the fact that majority of mono's break at above their stated b.s. , fishing for chub with 10lb plus line doesn't interest me, nor does catching 2lb plus roach on carp gear, as I've said, we are all different, strange though, I don't get broke often, balanced tackle is key I feel...

Unless you have very deep pockets then 40lb braid or traces wouldn’t cut it on most of the waters I fish with Jerkbaits. I want to be able to straighten the hook if I snag up. Fifteen quid for a lure, four quid for a titanium trace plus probably some braid would be about a score. Imagine losing three in a day, I’d still be crying next Wednesday week. It’s not that heavy just to land the fish, you could easily do that with; far, far, lighter breaking strain line. Jerk bait rods tend to be fairly unforgiving and coupling them with braid means the fish still has to be played with care to avoid hook pulls. The late Derek Gibson started the best thread on lure fishing ever on FM. Well worth rereading if you can find it. He used similar tackle to I described. It is horses for courses, I wouldn’t fish lighter smaller lures on 65lb braid, it has to have some balance. For general fishing I think it’s irresponsible to fish for your target species with line that species can break, even if it breaks on a known snag. I honestly don’t believe it’s sporting, in fact it’s harmful.

 

[Alan Whitty]

And yet stick some of the extremely large hooks on lures into fish, we see what we want to see us humans...

 

[Steve Arnold]

And yet stick some of the extremely large hooks on lures into fish, we see what we want to see us humans...

I really don't like a lot of the hooks on lures, or used by some for big carp, or many of the hooks used for sea fishing.....etc, etc, etc!

As I have said a few times now, I like the hook to be the weakest link in my tackle. Again, strong braid should pull hooks out of snags and a correctly chosen hook have enough "spring" left in the wire to ultimately start to straighten in a fishes lip. That usually results in the hook pulling, it's been my way of "releasing" a couple of big silure over my years here!

That's a trick I learnt when fishing the kelp along the Scottish coast. Strong braid line + soft(ish) hooks = getting your line and lead weight back.

How I wish I could catch some tasty Cabillaud here, I don't mind less than sporting tackle for that job! In the UK I never had to buy cod, fortunately I can get good "dos de cabillaud" in the supermarkets here. With practise my batter is now as good (better even!) than most chips shops fry.

Seems this thread has moved on to hooks, now there is a subject for discussion and opinions....

My mind though?..... that has moved on to food and cooking!

 

[Ray Roberts]

And yet stick some of the extremely large hooks on lures into fish, we see what we want to see us humans...

We don’t leave them still attached though.

 

[Badgerale]

I feel like people underestimate a pike's ability to break line.

It's true that they don't have the sustained power of a barbel or carp, but they do have a very erratic fight under the rod tip and, as well as acrobatics, can go from zero to full power in a heartbeat - it's that sudden shock that breaks lines more so than the plodding fight of a carp.

I reckon there is a far greater chance of losing a pike than other fish, partly that's the hard mouth, but any pike fisherman will know that they can seriously test gear and knots by going crazy at the net.

 

[chevin4]

I feel like people underestimate a pike's ability to break line.

It's true that they don't have the sustained power of a barbel or carp, but they do have a very erratic fight under the rod tip and, as well as acrobatics, can go from zero to full power in a heartbeat - it's that sudden shock that breaks lines more so than the plodding fight of a carp.

I reckon there is a far greater chance of losing a pike than other fish, partly that's the hard mouth, but any pike fisherman will know that they can seriously test gear and knots by going crazy at the net.

I find pike unpredictable years ago I fished a pit which was very coloured in winter the fish came in like wet sacks. Since 2013 I have been a member of a gravel pit syndicate two miles up the road. The water is rich and clear the pike which are small headed but very broad across the back fight like tigers similar to Loch pike. They tail walk and head shake even a 5lb fish gives an excellent account of itself on powerful tackle.

 

[@Clive]

I have either reduced the drag or used finger pressure on the rotor when I get a frisky fish near the net whether using braid or mono'. I prefer to switch the ar off and play the fish through the handle or by braking the rotor with my finger wherever possible, but when trying to manipulate a long landing net handle from high banks it is often better to slacken off the drag and use the ar.

 

[RMNDIL]

When we think we are playing a fish against a heavy drag and a doubled over rod we are only applying, at best, a few pounds of pressure on the hook-hold! Get a mate to take the end of your line attached to spring scales, then bend your 3.5lb carp rod fully into it and I doubt the scales will register more than a couple of pounds. You, with the rod bent, will think you are applying considerable pressure!

I'd like to think that with a 3 1/2lb TC carp rod that I could apply 3 1/2lb of 'force'. Last time I tested (1994, Drennan 13ft Continental carp rod) against a digital force meter I managed 11 1/2lb (with quite some effort it must be said - and much more than I would ever expect to apply 'playing' a fish). But you're absolutely right, we don't impart anywhere near as much force as we think.

 

[nottskev]

It's true we're often applying less force than we think via a bending rod. Gosh - how can we ever get broken? Fish (unlike the fence post/scales we might test-pull against) can move, and quickly, and force = mass x acceleration. Nobody who fishes with light gear ( as opposed to gear with a built-in might-hook-a-carp margin) is unfamiliar with the what happens when you strike at a bite from a fish already shooting off in the opposite direction. Playing fish is a dynamic business, and static measures are only a rough guide to how tackle will cope when things move.

 

[Steve Arnold]

It's true we're often applying less force than we think via a bending rod. Gosh - how can we ever get broken? Fish (unlike the fence post/scales we might test-pull against) can move, and quickly, and force = mass x acceleration. Nobody who fishes with light gear ( as opposed to gear with a built-in might-hook-a-carp margin) is unfamiliar with the what happens when you strike at a bite from a fish already shooting off in the opposite direction. Playing fish is a dynamic business, and static measures are only a rough guide to how tackle will cope when things move.

"gear with a built-in might-hook-a-carp margin" Yup, I like that description!

I am sure I would re-think my tackle if it was not for carp, silure .......and the rocks! I had carp to over 40lb when I was still using 12lb fluorocarbon hooklengths for barbel. But then I lost a few due to cut-offs and reconsidered my tackle, coated braids have just about eliminated losing fish. Not particularly "sporting" but the braids are still thin so do not discourage smaller species too much.

There is one weirpool that I fished for barbel and got cut off by two fast running fish in quick succession, I only had those 12lb fluoro hooklengths and continued fishing. The third fish I stayed attached to, but I had to take a dip and swim around a tree to net it, a carp of 13lb.

The following year I put a bait in the same spot, but from the opposite bank. Of course I had the ESP Tungsten loaded braid to my hook and this was the result.....

I think I started this thread with this fish

For chub in clearer swims I still have a few fluoro hooklengths made up, but even chub sometimes hang themselves on the coated braid!

I appreciate the river Lot is a totally different world of fishing to what I would have in the UK, just have to cope with it somehow!

 

[Alan Whitty]

We don’t leave them still attached though.

No, we leave a massive hole where that large gauge hook as torn through the flesh of a pike whilst tailgating, thrashing etc, and it definitely happens....

 

[@Clive]

I'd like to think that with a 3 1/2lb TC carp rod that I could apply 3 1/2lb of 'force'. Last time I tested (1994, Drennan 13ft Continental carp rod) against a digital force meter I managed 11 1/2lb (with quite some effort it must be said - and much more than I would ever expect to apply 'playing' a fish). But you're absolutely right, we don't impart anywhere near as much force as we think.

I've told this tale before. When I used to go sea fishing we all used 30lb or 50lb class solid fibreglass rod, 50lb mono or terylene cuttyhunk line and Alvey or Scarborough reels plus 16oz to 20oz pirks. The average cod weighed around 5lb or less. When Spiderwire came on the market I swapped to 50lb braid, a 12lb class rod and lever drag multiplier with 6oz to 8oz weights and muppet lures. I not only caught more, mainly due to being able to detect bites and strike, but because I was fishing more vertical and not getting snagged on the bottom or on other angler's lines. In Ireland I hoooked and landed more pollack than the other three combined, along with other species they never touched.

Of course I had suffered good natured ribbing about my "kid's tackle" from my friends. One day off Whitby during such a discussion I made a bet with one of my friends that he wouldn't be able to lift a bucket of water from the ground onto a chair with his 50lb Milbro Commander rod and Scarborough reel. Back in the harbour we put it to the test. Pete stood on a bench and tried to crane the gallon bucket weighing around 11lb onto a chair. He couldn't do more than skim the bucket over the floor despite him being 6' 4" and over 20 stone. The higher that he lifted the butt of the rod, the more the rod bent. He nearly suffered a heart attack trying, but my point was made and I enjoyed my prize of a free fish & chip supper.

 

[Ray Roberts]

No, we leave a massive hole where that large gauge hook as torn through the flesh of a pike whilst tailgating, thrashing etc, and it definitely happens....

Can’t say that I personally choose heavy gauge hooks, I want to get my lures Back if they snag up.

Most treble hooks that I personally use have the barbs crushed down for ease of unhooking and I would guess that each individual hook on the treble hooks I use is of a lighter gauge than a carp hook of the same size. The size of the hook has to match the size of the lure. It’s no good putting a size ten on a large jerk bait or a two on a dropshot. Pike have very boney mouths and the ones I release go back without any obvious signs of damage.

You can try to justify leaving line trailing from fish as “sporting” but my personal view is that it’s the exact opposite. When I hear of people saying they were done repeatedly from the same spot it makes me cringe. If I thought it was wrong to hook a fish then I would stop fishing altogether. When we fish catch and release, surely the objective is to land a fish while causing minimal damage, leaving them with a hook in their mouths and trailing line doesn’t fit with that at all.

 

[nottskev]

Braid users on here's reasons for using braid are as entirely clear and logical as mine are for not using it. They're doing kinds of fishing I don't and that's that. The posts today did remind me I picked this up, trailed along the bank, on Tuesday, but it could just as easily have been mono- it's the mentality of the angler, not their choice of line that's the problem. Where I was fishing, swans come onto the bank and robins, pied and even yellow wagtails (a bit warier) come to pick up crumbs and bits of bait, along with cats and dogs off the houseboats. It's a rare marina that lets anglers on, and this is the type of thing that gets us banned.

My own take on the "sporting" business is to neither risk more breakages than absolutely necessary, nor to use gear way out of proportion to what you're aiming to catch. Somewhere in between is balanced tackle where everything works together - rod, reel, line, hooks, angler's skill with them, and gets them all out bar the unforeseen, the gatecrashers etc. I bought a fishing mag the other day - a rare purchase - Match Fishing. It has a lot of good stuff, actually, on rivers and canals, but it makes me cringe when catching commie carp in the edge is called "hauling" and the gear advertised for it - basically 6m broomstick with bungee shocker - "hauling gear". Maybe you need that to prise a halibut off the ocean bed, but in a small pond .......