Otters on the Bristol Avon

Muffin

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http://www.gofishing.co.uk/Angling-...uge-decline-in-barbel-stocks-in-Bristol-Avon/

The above link is to a recent article I've seen, and I wondered what anyones views on the subject may be?

I've chatted to various much more experienced anglers than me, and read the recent (long) 'argument' on FM reagrding otter surveys and their impact on fish stocks, including no particular conclusion either way.

I guess the evidence is pretty strong concerning lack of fish catches, but this can be down to many more reasons than otters I guess. All I know is I'm damned if I'm ever gonna be able to catch another Bristol Avon Barbel!

Any useful thoughts on this greatly received, as its playing havoc with my confidence when fishing my local river at present.
 

captainbarnacles

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Just go fishing my friend and forget the otter , if he dont eat a few fish the pike will ,or heron,or many other preditors in the world. If there were as many otters as pike and zander and perch then i would worry. Anyway i think imigrents eat more than otters.
 

Greg Whitehead

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I wouldn't be too confident either after speaking to the clubs and tackleshops down there. Head upriver would appear to be the best advice where the Bristol Avon barbel are concerned.

---------- Post added at 16:26 ---------- Previous post was at 16:22 ----------

As for pike, perch, zander or cormorants, I've never seen any example of those species that can kill and eat a double-figure barbel. As for EEs, yes, there are reports they take barbel but I'd personally rather eat a bream (and that's saying something!). Barbel got big because there were no otters. Over the next decade, until otter and fish populations balance out properly, I doubt we'll see the number of big barbel we did over the past decade. Sh*t happens....
 

davegn

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Didn't I read about this on the old site?
I thought AT were going to look into the whole matter in some depth?
Otters have been on the Bristol Avon for some years now, according to those in the know, yet no furour over them until now?
Best just to leave them alone and let Mother Nature take her course, we all know the results of Man's interference in such matters!
 

jcs

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Hi Muffin

Just like to say a lot of my Barbel Fishing on the BA is done in daylight hour's and in the last few season's i have seen Otter,s even at this time of day on a few part's of the BA.
Which is not good for are fish stocks if there about feeding Day and Night.
Come on EA were's are help on restocking as Nick has said we all pay in to the Kitty what ever river you fish on,we all need to get behind Nick on this one, so there are still plenty of Barbel in the BA for the next generation of angler's to fish for and enjoy like we have and put The Bristol Avon back in the Top 5 river's again.
 
A

alan whittington

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Restocking,may as well put bags of dead fish down for the otters daily.:wh
 

Muffin

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I think I will be heading a bit further up river, although that plan did not work at the weekend, as the river was completly lifeless but at least I did not get soaking wet this time!

Thanks for all your thoughts
 

quickcedo

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I have fished the Claverton stretch for the last 3 years and have watched my catch rates fall. this year 3 trips, no Barbel. Maybe I'm just getting to be a worse fisherman. maybe the fish have moved. Maybe?
 

Stealph Viper

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This is a current article found on the Angling Trust website, with the WWF being involved i really can't see them agreeing to the removal of Otters unless it is done humanly.

The largest river action campaign ever seen in the UK has been launched this week.

The Our Rivers campaign is being launched by WWF, RSPB, Angling Trust and the Association of Rivers Trusts and is calling on the Government to be more ambitious if it is to deliver the positive change needed to protect Britain’s rivers.

The campaign's website features an interactive map of the UK’s rivers allowing users to highlight the issues facing their local waterway.

TV conservationist and RSPB vice president Chris Packham is one of those supporting the campaign: 'Our rivers are under pressure from so many sources, yet their health is vitally important to us all,' he said.

'Clean, healthy rivers, teeming with life are what we all want to see'
'Clean, healthy rivers, teeming with life are what we all want to see and what the Our Rivers campaign is all about.

'New water legislation is providing us with a unique opportunity to speak up for the rivers we love, you don't have to be an expert, you just need to know your river. Standing up for your river is easy to do, just go to the Our Rivers website.'

The Environment Agency (EA) will decide the fate of every river in the country through one of eleven regional management plans which are currently in public consultation, ending on 22 June. Final plans will be signed off by the Secretary of State at the end of the year.

The consultation taking place across the country has been criticised for failing to engage many of those who hold vital information about our rivers: anglers who have fished the same stretch for years, community groups who look after their local river and those who rely on the river for their business.

The launch of Our Rivers aims to address this concern by providing a far more straightforward way for people to pass on their unique local knowledge to the EA. The content of the management plans must be informed by those who know and care about their rivers; those who live and work on them.

Tom le Quesne, Freshwater Policy Officer at WWF said: 'This consultation is an important step in a process that must deliver a positive improvement to the state of the country’s rivers but the EA have so far failed to effectively involve river users and campaigners in their proposals.

'Our Rivers provides the opportunity for people across the country to take an active role in the consultation and tell Government what needs to be done to protect our rivers for years to come.'

Local knowledge from local people
The website is a key component of the campaign, enabling people to submit their views, to campaign at local level, win support from their MP and take action to increase the profile of Our Rivers. Information gathered through the website will be presented to the EA and Ministers as a formal request for action - to which they now have a legal obligation to respond.

'Anglers are the curtain twitchers of the river bank and are the first to notice when the insect life changes, the water colour changes or the flow is altered,” said Mark Lloyd of the Angling Trust. “The Angling Trust will be urging all its members to get involved in the Our Rivers campaign, to ensure that rivers get better protection and action now to restore them to their former glory, for the benefit of all wildlife.'

RSPB’s Director of Conservation, Mark Avery said: 'The results of a healthy river are clear to see – the darting blue of a kingfisher, the ripple of a fish jumping for flies and carpets of wild flowers covering a floodplain all provide a real sense of wildness that people enjoy. But for many rivers once common wildlife is missing or under threat.

'What is so exciting about this campaign is that it will be using local knowledge from people who care passionately about the rivers on their doorstep. This campaign will help people give Our Rivers a voice as the Environment Agency and Government set about planning for improvements to 2015 and beyond.'

Tight Lines :D
 

Muffin

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I have fished the Claverton stretch for the last 3 years and have watched my catch rates fall. this year 3 trips, no Barbel. Maybe I'm just getting to be a worse fisherman. maybe the fish have moved. Maybe?

I have heard of one fish (Barbel) being caught at Claverton so far this year not that I know everyone who fishes there!! I've not had much sucess even when I've just been targetting the silver fish. There are otters present there and a family of 4 mink and I've seen the black death so many times when I fished there over the winter it is quite disturbing!

I'm not sure on the impact of any of these creatures, but I know they wouyld not be there if there were no fish present, so surely there must still be some fish there, its just I cant catch them!

As for the fish moving, the river downstream gets much wider and slower and not really the suitable habitat for Barbel, and upstreat they are locked in by the weir (maybe) so I would have thought they are there somewhere, but it is surprising how many people have said that Claverton is not fishing anywhere near as well as it was a few years back, too many just to be coincidence.

---------- Post added at 12:05 ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 ----------

http://www.anglingtrust.net/survey/survey.asp?survey=20010003&preview=C85F28

The above link is to complete the Otter survey, however its not working it seams at present.
 

Steve Spiller

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Simon,
Have you seen an otter on the BA? Where are the reported sightings coming from?
As you know I've been fishing the BA for 37 years and I've never seen one. I have seen Mink, but that was a few years ago.

I know the catch rates at Claverton have fallen, but is that down to otters?

I've only targetted the barbel twice this season, due to the cr*p state of the river. I blanked twice, which isn't rare because there aren't many barbel where I fish, but I did notice the bream which are usually a pain in the ar$e weren't there either and that is very strange!

I would like to know if there is any solid evidence of otters on the BA.

---------- Post added at 15:41 ---------- Previous post was at 15:37 ----------

Claverton has been on the decline for years Simon, the big floods may have played a part too. Don't right off the deeper slower areas ;-)
 
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alan whittington

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Steve i apologise for being slightly off the BA tack but i find your statement interesting,i fish the Middle Thames and and am finding results similar to yours no barbel(it can be very difficult at best)but as you are finding i have had only one bream which would normally be an unheard of event,is this happening elsewhere on other rivers in the UK?
 

Muffin

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I cant comment on my own Barbel catches as I dont catch any at all, but do know of anglers much better than myself who have really struggled.

I have seen an otter at Claverton, he's a big ****** so no confusing with the family of 4 mink which also live there! Lovely to see them play last time I was on the river at Claverton, but not good for fishing I would imagine!

I have also seen an Otter at Limpley Stoke and have been told there is also one at Avoncliff, Otters are very teritorial apparently so there will only be a certain number per stretch of river. Couple that with reports of them in Bradford on Avon and one can build a picture that they are present all throughout the middle/lower avon.

I have been fishing the upper Avon recently and still been catching ****** all, so I cant make any conclusion either way!

Steve, let me know when you are next out on the river, would be good to catch up.
 

Steve Spiller

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Could be Greg. But wouldn't there be evidence of remains left in the margins or on the banks? Or do they scoff the lot?

Will do Simon, maybe this weekend?
 

Greg Whitehead

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Carcasses tend to be hard to find in the summer when things are so overgrown. They can eat everything from just a few mouthfuls to everything except the bones.
 

Woofy Chivers

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I have heard of one fish (Barbel) being caught at Claverton so far this year not that I know everyone who fishes there!! I've not had much sucess even when I've just been targetting the silver fish. There are otters present there and a family of 4 mink and I've seen the black death so many times when I fished there over the winter it is quite disturbing!

I'm not sure on the impact of any of these creatures, but I know they wouyld not be there if there were no fish present, so surely there must still be some fish there, its just I cant catch them!

As for the fish moving, the river downstream gets much wider and slower and not really the suitable habitat for Barbel, and upstreat they are locked in by the weir (maybe) so I would have thought they are there somewhere, but it is surprising how many people have said that Claverton is not fishing anywhere near as well as it was a few years back, too many just to be coincidence.

---------- Post added at 12:05 ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 ----------

http://www.anglingtrust.net/survey/survey.asp?survey=20010003&preview=C85F28

The above link is to complete the Otter survey, however its not working it seams at present.
I cant comment on my own Barbel catches as I dont catch any at all, but do know of anglers much better than myself who have really struggled.

I have seen an otter at Claverton, he's a big ****** so no confusing with the family of 4 mink which also live there! Lovely to see them play last time I was on the river at Claverton, but not good for fishing I would imagine!

I have also seen an Otter at Limpley Stoke and have been told there is also one at Avoncliff, Otters are very teritorial apparently so there will only be a certain number per stretch of river. Couple that with reports of them in Bradford on Avon and one can build a picture that they are present all throughout the middle/lower avon.

I have been fishing the upper Avon recently and still been catching ****** all, so I cant make any conclusion either way!

Steve, let me know when you are next out on the river, would be good to catch up.
I fished the BA for barbel for many years until about 10 yrs ago. Mainly Limpley Stoke , but also Avoncliffe. It was nothing for me to catch 3 or 4 barbel a night with a good number of doubles. But very quickly my catch rate deteriorated and in the end I was catching 3 or 4 a season ! Otters definitely had a lot to do with it as believe me they are all the way through the BA. I lost count how many times I saw them. Not only on the BA but also on the Cam brook , Wellow brook , Mells brook , the Somerset Frome and many lakes. There are that many of them I’ve seen them in Bradford on Avon town and even Pultney weir , Bath town centre ! They are vermin in my eyes Some do gooder I believe thought it would be a good idea to release a load of them on the BA. Even if the EA stocked the river with barbel every season I can’t see it ever getting back to the glory days. Unless it was allowed to be hunted with Otter hounds every year to lower the numbers the BA is and will be for a long , long time a shadow of its former self.
Andrew Chivers
 

Alan Whitty

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Hi Andrew, the Gt.Ouse and Ivel were fishing pretty consistently for barbel until bunny huggers built holts along several stretches, then we saw otters, during daylight hours, we found dead fish with organs eaten, but unmarked apart from tail damage, within four years the barbel that were left were virtually uncatchable, that was even after the EA stocked a few in, to this day these rivers are hardly worth fishing for barbel, unless you can stand numerous blanks to pick one up (and I mean numerous), the problems come from the lack of recruitment in rivers for the species....
 

Woofy Chivers

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Hello Allan ,
To be honest the barbel fishing on the BA got that bad I don’t bother frustrating myself with blank after blank anymore. I occasionally do a bit of piking but that is as far as it goes. I’m lucky enough to be on a syndicate on the beautiful river Wye nowadays which to be honest is expensive but the barbel fishing is excellent. The worst thing is the distance to get there but at the end of the day the barbel fishing at times is fantastic so it’s worth travelling.
The deterioration of the BA is undoubtably down to otters. But other factors have contributed to its downfall such as floods and not being stocked regularly. I’ve watched the barbel spawning many times on the shallow gravel areas in its hay day but I never caught a small one. So once the big fish came to the end of it’s life or was eaten by an otter there were no juveniles to grow and take there place.
Sadly the BA will not recover in my life time if ever without culling the vermin and being stocked every season with plenty of small barbel.
I’m not holding my breath for that to happen. Tight lines !
Andy Chivers
 
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