The Old Specimen Groups

[Ron Troversial Clay]

I have just looked up some of the names in the Hitchin AC group who caught all those big fish in the 50s.

I refer to Jim Gibbinson's book: "Modern Specimen Hunting"

This group consisted of:

**** Walker, Pete Thomas, Maurice Ingham, Trevor Lockhart, Bob Rutland, Brian Collins and Alan Brown.

They won the 1951 Daily Mirror Specimen Fish Contest with 464 points. The runners up scored 97 points.

The following year they joined another club: Shefford AC. They would have won that one too if the secretary had remembered to send of the application form.

I think this little group of anglers were the first ever specimen group in the way we as modern anglers will remember and recognise such groups.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Thank's for that Graham. I thought that Tony Goldstraw was from your neck of the woods.

It's fascinating to note that some of these anglers, who were complete fanatics in their day and so was I, have now given up fishing completely. Maybe it is a result of what Barrie Rickards calls "Burn Out", in other words doing too much fishing in too short a period of time.

I think you can do too much fishing.

Barrie in his book - Angling Fundamentals also describes the other type of angler. The "Slow Burner" who fishes all his life but doesn't do too much of it. The Slow Burner also fishes for all species and is not blinded by fishing for one.

I think I put myself here. Although I have had a few periods in my life where I have done less fishing, I have never had the inclination to give it up.

I can also look back and consider that I have done virtually all types of angling in a lesser or greater degree. I feel lucky to have had that chance.

 

[Bob Hornegold 3]

Ron,

Peter Mohan was the Syndicate leader of an estate lake that I still fish.

Although now the water is part of a Big House converted into Flats and the Six of us fishing the water are called Wardens ?

What about anglers like Pete Frost, Jack Hilton and Ken Whitehead, who I remember as being well known Specimen Hunters.

How many of these Great old Anglers are still fishing.

Pity we could not organise a reunion of the Specimen Groups from yesteryear ?

As for Burn Out maybe being an all rounder helps ?

The ability to change species and catch successfully throughout the whole season must help.

In fact I cannot remember the older Anglers in our Group, thinking we were Mad to fish the Cut at Peterborough throughout Christmas in 1962 ?

When it was warmer in the water than out, but of course I was only 17 then ?

Bob

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

The last time I saw Peter Frost was at a talk at The Open University - Milton Keynes where we had Peter Stone and Fred J Taylor. It was called "Last of the Summer Wine" - a great evening.

Jack Hilton gave up fishing to follow his religious beliefs. He was a Jehova's Witness. Then he died a few years ago. Ken Whitehead did a couple of books with Barrie Rickards. I never met him.

The last time there was a real re-union of the old specimen hunters was at the Carp Society Richard Walker Memorial Conference at Dunstable in 1988. I couldn't get there. A 12,000 miles round trip was difficult for me then.

A short list of some of the people present makes interesting recording:

Len Arbury, Bruce Ashby, Tag Barnes, Ron Barnet, Bob Beuteux, Kevin Clifford, John Carver, Bob Davis, Rex Elgood, Ken Ewington (there's a name to be remembered), Jim Gibbinson, Len Head, Jerry Savage, Gerry Hughes, Jack Hargreaves, Rod Hutchnison, Chris Yates, Andy Little, Tom Mintram, Ritchie MacDonald, John Nixon, Bill Quinlan, Pat Russell, George Sharman, Peter Stone, Pete Springate, Joe Taylor, Chris Ball, Eric Hodson, Jack Thorndyke, Fred Wilton, Gerry Berth- Jones, **** Kefford, Fred J Taylor, Harry Grief, Bernard Venables, Pete Thomas, Des Taylor, Pat Walker, Richard Walker Jnr, Tim Walker, Simon Walker and Robert Walker.

There's a list of names for you. Many of which are now deceased.

The only two members of the original Carp Catchers Club who are still alive are Fred J Taylor and Pete Thomas.

Next August marks the 20th anniversary of the Death of **** Walker.

Maybe we should have a get together of all the old Specimen Hunters at about that time. It may be more appropriate to wait whilst 25 years have past, but I fear there may not be many around if we did.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Peter Mohan together with Eric Hodson formed the British Carp Study Group by the way.

I was made a member in 1969 I think.

Does the BCSG still exist?

I'll ask The Monk, he knows everything.

 

[Warren 'Hatrick' (Wol) Gaunt]

Yes is does Ron, i have my membership card here.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Thanks Wol. It is gratifying to know this august society still exists.

Personally I would love to be a member of an all round group. But such organisations don't seem to exist any more. Today it's all about specialisation.

A pity in a way.

 

[Bob Hornegold 3]

20th anniversity Sounds good to me,pity NASA fell away under pressure of the political section.

How would you go about setting up a reunion of the Old Groups ?

There are still some Specimen Groups around that are successful, but most people seem only interested in single species groups.

As you say Ron, it's a shame.

Bob

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Bob,

I would love to do it myself, but I would need the help of a lot of people, most important of them - The Monk.

(I hope he is monitoring this thread)

I envisage booking somewhere in the Midlands like that Hotel at Loughborough where we could have a tackle show, a bar, and a series of talks and slide shows by a few selected people who would make the occasion a lot of fun.

FUN WITH A CAPITAL "F"

No politics, no meetings and no AGM!!

The sorts of presentations I visualise are:

"What it's like to be taken the piss out of" by Eddie Bibby

"How I have strengthened my back muscles to carry my enormous wallet" by Graham Marsden.

"Pulling Pole Sections Apart" by Jeff Woodhouse

"Living down my times with Kelly and Higginbottom" by Matt Hayes.

"How I showed my assole on a movie" by Des Taylor.

"How to Nick other angler's swims" by Barney Ribble

Bring back some fun into the game.

It would be a fabulous day and I am sure Walker and all his old mates would approve.

Come on Monk.

 

[The Monk]

yes the BCSG still exists, its only a small group though, and sadly still operates under a selected criteria basis, it is now however politically active and an SAA supporter, so all credit to the people who run it now! I can remember Eric pulling away from the organisation when Peter de-politicised the organisation and took it away from the NASG.

Bob, SAA was a natural progression for NASA, caused through social and political climatic change at the time. The social side of SAA (NASA) is still there should anyone wish to take up the job of organising that side of things

 

[jason fisher]

And there are many tales that could be told. says ron about walkers cottage.

well bluddi well get on and start telling em before it gets too late.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Ah but Jason, many of those stories could not be repeated on a family website like FM.

What a place it was to bring a Ruffe Slapper.

 

[jason fisher]

i'm sure there are some you could tell and aren't doing so. this is angling history you are depriving us of.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Jason,

I have sent an account of a day I spent with **** Walker at his fishing hut to Barrie Rickards for use in his book.

I will re-write it slightly and maybe send it to Graham, to protect innocent people involved.

 

[jason fisher]

about time too.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

I'll get it done tomorrow.

I have a picture of that hut. And of the swim Two Willows.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

"Before it is too late"

Do you mean before I pop my clogs or become senile.

Mind you, the four anglers who could tell the most are Tag Barnes, Peter Stone, Ian Howcroft and Fred J Taylor.

Fred is still around, Ian lives in Oz and both Tag Barnes and Peter Stone are chasing chub by the big stream in the sky.

Peter Drennan could also tell a story or two, as could Frank Guttfield.

And then there is Old Tony Shepherdson. One of ****s personal friends, who caught a six pound chub from the stretch. I wonder if he is still alive. He came out and spent some time with me and a friend in South Africa ca 1991.

Tony lived in Letchworth. He was a chiropodist and a lovely bloke.

Walker once announced to Tony that his wife (Tony's) had the best pair of tits in Hertfordshire and then he.........

Oh I'm getting carried away. These are stories for another time and another day.

 

[Ron Troversial Clay]

Walker could mimic many different accents. I think his most funny anecdote was the one about the two east end anglers he told to me and Tag Barnes one night in his hut.

He also told that story to Jim Gibbinson I believe. Jim will confirm this I am sure. We revived the tale when Jime spent 2 weeks with me in SA during 79.

But that story must go on Bait Box

 

[jason fisher]

These are stories for another time and another day. you will keep saying that till you've forgotten em though.
that's why i said before it's too late.

 

[Bob Hornegold 3]

Okay Gentlemen,

Maybe between us we could organise a Meeting of the Old Groups for next year ?

If each of us contacted as many of the old members of our own Groups to judge the interest in such an event.

And with Graham's blessing colated them on FishingMagic, it just might happen ?

Monk, as you know I was and still are a member of NASA/SAA and wrote for the Magazine and agree that we need to be political.

But for many older members the Political side has overtaken the Specimen Group side of things.

As you say someone should volunteer, a thankless task judging by some of later NASA fish-ins ?

Bob