Princes Albert Angling Society

thames mudlarker

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I have Ian! It is a bit long winded but I managed it. I await an email from a mod to confirm I may participate and offer an opinion or two!:) I am going to try the closest water to me today.

Best of luck for today Mike :thumbs:

Be lucky
 

tigger

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I have Ian! It is a bit long winded but I managed it. I await an email from a mod to confirm I may participate and offer an opinion or two!:) I am going to try the closest water to me today.

Good Luck ! :w
 

mikench

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Infamy infamy the fish have got it infamy:rolleyes: you wait years to be accepted and then try a lake you have known as a non angler for 30 years and when you finally get on the bank to fish you blank!:( Not even a bite !

Shall I resign and ask for my money back? It is little consolation but 2 carpers who had been there since Friday also blanked and a guy who was two pegs up from me caught 3 roach on a method feeder!!

Very disappointing in truth but that is fishing for you! I had to be home by 4.00 for other duties. There is always next week:rolleyes:
 

thames mudlarker

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Infamy infamy the fish have got it infamy:rolleyes: you wait years to be accepted and then try a lake you have known as a non angler for 30 years and when you finally get on the bank to fish you blank!:( Not even a bite !

Shall I resign and ask for my money back? It is little consolation but 2 carpers who had been there since Friday also blanked and a guy who was two pegs up from me caught 3 roach on a method feeder!!

Very disappointing in truth but that is fishing for you! I had to be home by 4.00 for other duties. There is always next week:rolleyes:

Nothermind mind, there's always another day,

Don't forget that although we've had the odd few nice days that water is probably still very cold which in tern means that the fish are more likely to be lerthargic.
 

thecrow

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when you finally get on the bank to fish you blank! Not even a bite !

Angling is full of anti climaxes I am afraid, sometimes the anticipation of the day exceeds the fishing but something can always be learned on any blank day even if its that sometimes angling isn't easy :)
 

dave m

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it can get very busy on the carp waters at weekends, and it might not be the peaceful utopia that some people wish for when joining the pa.
the same can be said of most/all clubs in the cheshire area though. the boom in carp fishing and the lack of waters means that the days of seclusion might have gone by.
 
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thecrow

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Why do clubs including this one insist on charging a joining fee, I see this one is £100, where does it go how can this be justified? or is it just a way for a club with a high turnover of members to collect money from new members each year?
 

sam vimes

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Why do clubs including this one insist on charging a joining fee, I see this one is £100, where does it go how can this be justified? or is it just a way for a club with a high turnover of members to collect money from new members each year?

The logic behind joining fees is generally along the lines of membership retention and getting members to rejoin promptly to keep incomes level and regular (usually at about the right time for lease renewals to be paid). Clubs that don't have joining fees can often suffer fairly wild fluctuations in income. Just the weather can affect them badly as members put off rejoining until they actually wish to go. The prospect of having to pay a joining fee again can make such people renew in a timely manner.

The only other ways I've seen joining fees used is to dissuade those that are less than serious in their angling intentions. On syndicates, it can do the above and dissuade those that put their names on waiting lists only to refuse membership when offered it. The thinking is that such people should contribute at least a little extra. It doesn't come close to the expenditure of members that join at the start in anticipation of the fish reaching certain sizes. I think you might be surprised at the number of people that go on waiting lists only to dither when actually offered a place.

Personally, I'm not a fan of joining fees, especially for clubs. I've discounted joining more than the odd one because of them. However, I understand why they may wish to enforce them. One thing is for sure, I have no doubt that the relatively minor extra income goes back into the club. No one is creaming off joining fees and stuffing them into their back pockets. The vast majority of angling clubs are doing little more than balancing their books on an annual basis. Plenty are losing money but relying on surplusses from years past to keep them afloat. Whether joining fees help or hinder their mission to break even is debateable. However, if the clubs concerned believe it helps, good luck to them.
 

thames mudlarker

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The logic behind joining fees is generally along the lines of membership retention and getting members to rejoin promptly to keep incomes level and regular (usually at about the right time for lease renewals to be paid). Clubs that don't have joining fees can often suffer fairly wild fluctuations in income. Just the weather can affect them badly as members put off rejoining until they actually wish to go. The prospect of having to pay a joining fee again can make such people renew in a timely manner.

The only other ways I've seen joining fees used is to dissuade those that are less than serious in their angling intentions. On syndicates, it can do the above and dissuade those that put their names on waiting lists only to refuse membership when offered it. The thinking is that such people should contribute at least a little extra. It doesn't come close to the expenditure of members that join at the start in anticipation of the fish reaching certain sizes. I think you might be surprised at the number of people that go on waiting lists only to dither when actually offered a place.

Personally, I'm not a fan of joining fees, especially for clubs. I've discounted joining more than the odd one because of them. However, I understand why they may wish to enforce them. One thing is for sure, I have no doubt that the relatively minor extra income goes back into the club. No one is creaming off joining fees and stuffing them into their back pockets. The vast majority of angling clubs are doing little more than balancing their books on an annual basis. Plenty are losing money but relying on surplusses from years past to keep them afloat. Whether joining fees help or hinder their mission to break even is debateable. However, if the clubs concerned believe it helps, good luck to them.

Couldn't agree more Chris,

In truth I've actually been a little guilty of this meself and no doubt I'm sure there's a few others that have done the same :rolleyes:

A few times I've put me name down on waiting lists for various clubs and then when a place is finally offered am often dithering wandering in what to do simply because there's so many waters out there that we all like to fish but know that we can't join and fish em all and so it's then a case of picking and choosing and sometimes not always easy :D

At one time I'd join clubs anywhere around London and home county catchment which is one massive area, if one thinks this would include, Kent, Sussex, Hants, Surrey, Berks, Bucks, Beds, Herts and Essex boarders,

Nowadays i tend to stick to Kent clubs and with the exception of the Lea valley aswell as I've now fished the Lea for around 28 years and know it very well :D
 

morston1

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Another reason for joining fees, at least in a number of clubs that I have been involved with, is as a part payment for past expenditure.

This may happen where clubs have bought heir own waters or invested in infrastructure such as car parks etc. this is sometimes done by taking out loans or, in one fly fishing club, they had a policy of buying any piece of water, that they had on lease, if it ever became available....often by a few members chipping in to raise the money.

It is only reasonable for new members to bear part of the cost of the facilities and fishing they will benefit from.

As for the PAAs they have bought many of their waters over the years
 

sam vimes

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That's a good idea, pay for something you didn't have :)

That's viewing it as you being nothing more than a paying customer buying a product from a profit making organization. Many people do view clubs this way, but it usually isn't the reality. It might be better to think of it as becoming a member of a co-operative non-profit organization. Even if such a club does turn a profit, the money will be invested in some way to improve the lot of the membership. Usually, this will be in the form of stocking and fishery husbandry. If the surplusses are large enough, they might be used to keep future price rises as low as possible. Some clubs only survive on the exesses built up in years past.

A new member of a proper angling club (one with its own waters) does get the benefit of previous expenditure. Bank/peg work, stockings, weed management and water purchases carried out in previous years will all benefit a new member without them having made any financial contribution.
 

mikench

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The two clubs I joined last year had a joining fee, albeit around half of PAAS, which I paid. I just had to join PAAS when the chance came and only time will tell whether I do justice to being a member by fishing regularly and at as many waters as possible. I have renewed at one of the other clubs because I like their waters, all the owners of the waters I have fished have been very friendly and the two bailiffs I have met have been very pleasant and helpful. I have also seen the hard work they have put in on my favourite water to repair pegs, cut back undergrowth and trees and generally maintain the water. In addition I have made a good few friends as everyone is friendly and helpful. That alone made me rejoin.

I have also felt a little guilty in not as yet volunteering for a working party so my joining fee is a quid pro quo somewhat.

The bailiffs do have a banter in very technical language when assessing the repairs needed to a platform! " This peg is f****d" which does cause me to smile as the words drift across the lake!:rolleyes:
 

thecrow

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That's viewing it as you being nothing more than a paying customer buying a product from a profit making organization.

If I pay for my fishing I don't want to be paying more for my first year for it than someone who is in say their 2nd season with the club. the joining fee for some clubs is just ridiculous well into hundreds of pounds. One that I know of has a joining fee of £345.
 
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sam vimes

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If I pay for my fishing I don't want to be paying more for my first year for it than someone who is in say their 2nd season with the club. the joining fee for some clubs is just ridiculous well into hundreds of pounds. One that I know of has a joining fee of £345.

As I've already stated, I'm not the biggest fan of joining fees either. I'm definitely not a supporter of them. I have not joined some clubs because of them. They lose out on my cash every which way because of them. In some clubs and syndicates I've been involved in efforts to remove them or stop them being adopted. I'm not entirely convinced that they aren't counter-productive in many instances. However, I've given you some of the possible reasons behind them. Whether we accept them or not is down to the individual. You pay your money and make your choice, or not.

If we choose to consider ourselves as nothing more than a customer of a business, there's no way anyone will accept them willingly. However, genuine businesses hike their prices to cover past or future expenses in ways that proper clubs and syndicates rarely do. One thing I'm certain of, clubs with joining fees only have them if they believe that it's in the long term interests of the club and their membership. Whether you or I disagree with them is largely immaterial.
 

tigger

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Some clubs give you something for the joining fee, such as large map books, keys etc etc which would cost the majority of the joining fee if you had to buy it separately anyhow.
 

mikench

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Well said Ian! The quality of the maps and details of each water and the binder to put them in is very impressive! Not worth £100 but impressive non the less and an improvement on what other clubs offer. I m happy and that is all that matters;)
 

thecrow

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Some clubs give you something for the joining fee, such as large map books, keys etc etc which would cost the majority of the joining fee if you had to buy it separately anyhow.


They would need to be some books maps and keys Ian to make up for the £345 joining fee of one club I know of, that makes it £620 for the first season :eek:

---------- Post added at 21:22 ---------- Previous post was at 21:21 ----------

I m happy and that is all that matters

To you maybe :)
 
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